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Greetings all,
I went to the doctor earlier this week and we got to discussing the usefulness of probiotics. This particular doctor is my ob/gyn who is semi-retired now. Since retiring he has taken a keen interest in holistic medicine. He was asking about all my GI issues and which probiotic I used. (Align) He wasn't familiar with Align, but promised to do some research on whether this was the best choice for me from a holistic standpoint.
Well, he called me today and said he had read up on Align. Apparently, he was not impressed. He suggested I consider using a probiotic from MD Prescriptives. He thought it would provide me greater gut protection given its' properties.
Probiotics is not something I've done much reading about, so many of his points were lost on me. I just know that I have less frequent bathroom visits when I take Align, and that's about where it ends with me and probiotic knowledge.
I know many of you here are well versed on probiotics and I would welcome your thoughts on this product. The product name is "PureBiotic". The website for the product (and their other products as well) is:
http://mdprescriptives.com/?p=11&l=2
If you have any thoughts on this product or how it may differ from your average OTC probiotic, I would love to hear your thoughts. I've been a patient of this doctor for over 30 years (can that be true...LOL?!) so I generally trust his opinion. However, in this case I know he sits on the Advisory Board of this company, so I'm approaching his recommendation with some healthy skepticism. Could it really be that much more effective or is he just trying to sell me on a product he backs?
Thanks guys!
Julie
Probiotic...do you know this one?
Moderators: Rosie, Stanz, Jean, CAMary, moremuscle, JFR, Dee, xet, Peggy, Matthew, Gabes-Apg, grannyh, Gloria, Mars, starfire, Polly, Joefnh
Julie,
First, I'll start by pointing out that I know very little about probiotics, and have I never used one, (except for saurkraut and yogurt).
The probiotic strains found in PureBiotic are commonly found in other probiotic products, (which is a good sign), but usually not in combination, (IOW, many probiotic products contain only a single strain of bacteria). Align, for example, contains only Bifidobacterium infantis, which is supposedly found in no other probiotic product. Other products, such as VSL#3, contain many different strains, and a much higher population count, per dose.
Probably, since we are all different, the only way to determine whether or not such a product is worth considering, is to try it. You're right to be suspicious, because the difference between conventional physicians, and other practitioners, is that medical doctors are not allowed to sell drugs, and more than a few have lost their license because of that temptation. Holistic practitioners, on the other hand, probably make a significant percentage of their income from the sale of various unregulated, (by the FDA), supplements, and "natural" treatments.
Tex
First, I'll start by pointing out that I know very little about probiotics, and have I never used one, (except for saurkraut and yogurt).
The probiotic strains found in PureBiotic are commonly found in other probiotic products, (which is a good sign), but usually not in combination, (IOW, many probiotic products contain only a single strain of bacteria). Align, for example, contains only Bifidobacterium infantis, which is supposedly found in no other probiotic product. Other products, such as VSL#3, contain many different strains, and a much higher population count, per dose.
Probably, since we are all different, the only way to determine whether or not such a product is worth considering, is to try it. You're right to be suspicious, because the difference between conventional physicians, and other practitioners, is that medical doctors are not allowed to sell drugs, and more than a few have lost their license because of that temptation. Holistic practitioners, on the other hand, probably make a significant percentage of their income from the sale of various unregulated, (by the FDA), supplements, and "natural" treatments.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
My friend's daughter went through a bout of c diff (and pneumonia) this spring and was told that while taking an antibiotic (in the future) to take a place-holder bec. the antibiotic will kill the good as well as the bad bacteria. This place-holder is called Florastor (sacchromyces boulardi). The rest of the time it was recommended she take a probiotic with 3 strains called Florajen 3 (lacto bacillus acidophilus, bifido bacterium lactis, bifido bacterium longum). I think it was the pharmacist who made these recommendations. Her doctor had prescribed two antibiotics for her after a minor surgery that resulted in the c diff.
I have no personal experience with this but it is something to read about anyway.
I have no personal experience with this but it is something to read about anyway.
kathy
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Sheila
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florastor
I had C diff in Dec/January/Feb that resulted from antibiotic use. It also triggered a huge flare of CC and I was diagnosed in April. My GI doc told me to take Florastor while I had the C diff and while I was on flagyl. He recommends to continue taking one a day normally and if you must take an antibiotic, take up to 3 a day. I'm still taking it thinking that it probably can't hurt.
Sheila
Sheila
To get something you never had, you have to do something you never did.
A person who never made a mistake never tried something new. Einstein
A person who never made a mistake never tried something new. Einstein
Sheila,
Antibiotics were part of the whole package for my first round of CC as well. I know I may need to take an antibiotic again at some point, and appreciate that they are a miracle of saving humankind. But...
The probiotic organism in Florastor, Saccharomyces boulardii, was like a miracle for my late mother's recurring C.diff infections - not only antibiotic induced, but hospital acquired. They posted signs outside her room about taking infectious precautions, but it was horrifying to watch the cavalier attitude. I would not be surprised if the staff passed her infection on to any number of other patients... many of them probably currently healthy, but next time *they* take an antibiotic - watch out.
I 'prescribed' the S. boulardii to my mother myself - and she didn't have a FOURTH recurrence of C. diff. thereafter. So I do believe it can outcompete the evil C.diff. successfully. As I recall, I had her take it for about 6 weeks - maybe longer - to make sure that we had outlasted the reproductive cycle of the horrible bug.
I tried that same S. boulardii supplement when I was first sick and did not tolerate it well. (I wasn't tolerating air and water all that well at that point - so I am not sure whether it's a "true" intolerance.) I have since had very good luck with another probiotic formulation, and I'm not throwing out the S. boulardii, which is certified GF/SF/DF/EF. But of course, it could still have an ingredient other than the yeast itself that does not agree with me. I just noted that it expires this year... I really believe that it works, but am not sure whether it works for me. I truly hope that C. diff. and I have parted ways for the long term.
C. diff. is a nightmare. Flagyl is horrible - I have had two courses of it, and hope never to meet up with that particular medication again...
I hope you're well clear of C. diff and can focus on the next phase of healing your CC!
And by the way, I *lovelovelove* your signature quote. It makes me want to go out and do something I've never done. I will keep you posted on how that goes.
Love,
Sara
p.s. hazel - thanks for the Florajen tip. I might give that a try, as I couldn't find the probiotic I recently found helpful (from Mega Foods).
Antibiotics were part of the whole package for my first round of CC as well. I know I may need to take an antibiotic again at some point, and appreciate that they are a miracle of saving humankind. But...
The probiotic organism in Florastor, Saccharomyces boulardii, was like a miracle for my late mother's recurring C.diff infections - not only antibiotic induced, but hospital acquired. They posted signs outside her room about taking infectious precautions, but it was horrifying to watch the cavalier attitude. I would not be surprised if the staff passed her infection on to any number of other patients... many of them probably currently healthy, but next time *they* take an antibiotic - watch out.
I 'prescribed' the S. boulardii to my mother myself - and she didn't have a FOURTH recurrence of C. diff. thereafter. So I do believe it can outcompete the evil C.diff. successfully. As I recall, I had her take it for about 6 weeks - maybe longer - to make sure that we had outlasted the reproductive cycle of the horrible bug.
I tried that same S. boulardii supplement when I was first sick and did not tolerate it well. (I wasn't tolerating air and water all that well at that point - so I am not sure whether it's a "true" intolerance.) I have since had very good luck with another probiotic formulation, and I'm not throwing out the S. boulardii, which is certified GF/SF/DF/EF. But of course, it could still have an ingredient other than the yeast itself that does not agree with me. I just noted that it expires this year... I really believe that it works, but am not sure whether it works for me. I truly hope that C. diff. and I have parted ways for the long term.
C. diff. is a nightmare. Flagyl is horrible - I have had two courses of it, and hope never to meet up with that particular medication again...
I hope you're well clear of C. diff and can focus on the next phase of healing your CC!
And by the way, I *lovelovelove* your signature quote. It makes me want to go out and do something I've never done. I will keep you posted on how that goes.
Love,
Sara
p.s. hazel - thanks for the Florajen tip. I might give that a try, as I couldn't find the probiotic I recently found helpful (from Mega Foods).
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Sheila
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Hi Sara,
I enjoyed your report of your trip to Paris. It's on my bucket list and I hope to get there one of these days. It is encouraging that the local French chefs wanted to actually help you enjoy their food.
That quote became my mantra after my husband died in 2002 after 36 years of marriage. He was a workaholic and you know what that means.
Both times I went to Europe when he was alive I went with friends. I'm a birder and I decided to go to places that were really off the beaten path. It was fun. After a few years I did get lonely and joined Match.com much to the horror of my sons. 
That was something I NEVER thought I would do either. My present husband is an adventurous soul and we have gone to some pretty wild places in our 4 years of marriage.
Thank you for all your tips and for sharing what you have learned while living with CC. I started Entocort on Thursday and norman has been my friend daily. I'm only taking 2 a day to avoid constipation.
Did you notice that the male winner at Wimbelton is on a GF diet? He was diagnosed as "allergic" to gluten a year ago and says he's a much better athlete since he changed his diet.
Sheila
I enjoyed your report of your trip to Paris. It's on my bucket list and I hope to get there one of these days. It is encouraging that the local French chefs wanted to actually help you enjoy their food.
That quote became my mantra after my husband died in 2002 after 36 years of marriage. He was a workaholic and you know what that means.
Both times I went to Europe when he was alive I went with friends. I'm a birder and I decided to go to places that were really off the beaten path. It was fun. After a few years I did get lonely and joined Match.com much to the horror of my sons. That was something I NEVER thought I would do either. My present husband is an adventurous soul and we have gone to some pretty wild places in our 4 years of marriage. Thank you for all your tips and for sharing what you have learned while living with CC. I started Entocort on Thursday and norman has been my friend daily. I'm only taking 2 a day to avoid constipation.
Did you notice that the male winner at Wimbelton is on a GF diet? He was diagnosed as "allergic" to gluten a year ago and says he's a much better athlete since he changed his diet.
Sheila
To get something you never had, you have to do something you never did.
A person who never made a mistake never tried something new. Einstein
A person who never made a mistake never tried something new. Einstein
Sheila,
I had read something about our GF tennis hero a couple of months back - it must be a huge transition, and he would have had to get his coach on board, or whoever was giving him nutritional advice previously. Very encouraging, that he was able to bring his level of performance to such a level within a year of making considerable dietary change (presumably motivated by some health issues that got his attention).
I don't have children, but I think it's good to horrify one's kids now and then, whether with match.com, birding, or other adventures. I have always been a "different drummer" kinda gal, but for years have been pretty good at falling into line. Now I'm thinking... really? What line?
Thanks for sharing your bucket list thoughts... I am always torn between going back to a beloved placed I've known before, and experiencing something new. In my parents' declining years, we traveled much less, and then that became kind of a habit. But I believe Paris really reignited our curiosity, and showed us a way to manage travel with MC, while including our own whims and accommodating family, so I feel optimistic for our next adventure, and lucky we can dream of such things.
Very glad to hear you got off to such a fine start with Entocort, too...
--Sara
I had read something about our GF tennis hero a couple of months back - it must be a huge transition, and he would have had to get his coach on board, or whoever was giving him nutritional advice previously. Very encouraging, that he was able to bring his level of performance to such a level within a year of making considerable dietary change (presumably motivated by some health issues that got his attention).
I don't have children, but I think it's good to horrify one's kids now and then, whether with match.com, birding, or other adventures. I have always been a "different drummer" kinda gal, but for years have been pretty good at falling into line. Now I'm thinking... really? What line?
Thanks for sharing your bucket list thoughts... I am always torn between going back to a beloved placed I've known before, and experiencing something new. In my parents' declining years, we traveled much less, and then that became kind of a habit. But I believe Paris really reignited our curiosity, and showed us a way to manage travel with MC, while including our own whims and accommodating family, so I feel optimistic for our next adventure, and lucky we can dream of such things.
Very glad to hear you got off to such a fine start with Entocort, too...
--Sara
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Sheila
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- Joined: Wed May 18, 2011 5:10 am
- Location: Palm Beach Gardens, Fl
I would be interested to hear Djokovic's story about his decision to go gluten free. Tough for an athlete who travels most of the time. Of course, he probably has no money problems and that helps you to get what you need.
Sharaine, I've gone back to taking one entocort in the a.m. and another after dinner. I felt better when I did that than when I took 2 in the a.m. I may try to just take 1. Don't really like the idea of taking steroids. I am taking the Florastor hoping that there are happy little bacteria floating around my colon munching on whatever it is that Florastor feeds them.
You always marched to a different drummer, Sara, and I was always pretty much a conformist. I got tired of life being so predictable and caring so much about what other people thought of me. After my husband died 10 years ago, I really looked at my life and decided to do what I wanted to do, within reason and within my budget, things that would be interesting and fulfilling. It has been a lot of fun, some interesting disasters notwithstanding, and I no longer give a flying ^&%$ what other people think of me. I mostly still look like Ms. Talbots but in my heart, I'm wearing a tatoo and tie dye. At my age, there is no time to waste.
Sheila
[/b]
Sharaine, I've gone back to taking one entocort in the a.m. and another after dinner. I felt better when I did that than when I took 2 in the a.m. I may try to just take 1. Don't really like the idea of taking steroids. I am taking the Florastor hoping that there are happy little bacteria floating around my colon munching on whatever it is that Florastor feeds them.
You always marched to a different drummer, Sara, and I was always pretty much a conformist. I got tired of life being so predictable and caring so much about what other people thought of me. After my husband died 10 years ago, I really looked at my life and decided to do what I wanted to do, within reason and within my budget, things that would be interesting and fulfilling. It has been a lot of fun, some interesting disasters notwithstanding, and I no longer give a flying ^&%$ what other people think of me. I mostly still look like Ms. Talbots but in my heart, I'm wearing a tatoo and tie dye. At my age, there is no time to waste.
Sheila
[/b]
To get something you never had, you have to do something you never did.
A person who never made a mistake never tried something new. Einstein
A person who never made a mistake never tried something new. Einstein
Sheila,
I truly believe that not worrying about what other people think of us is one of the great gifts of middle age* - even for those of us who always (more or less) played by the rules. I find the less I worry about what other people think, the more fascinating they seem to find me. One day I was on the way to the dog park, with my hair totally unkempt, wearing the kind of wardrobe you'd only put on for the dog park, when the cutest young ultra-chic urban teenagers stopped me and said, "excuse me, ma'am, I really like your outfit." Go figure! So I'm just going with it now - not just on the appearance level, either. Though I'm cherishing the mental image of you in your Talbot's style and inner tie-dye.
I was a very shy kid, and even after I outgrew it, I had shy 'habits' in the way I thought of myself. But I think I've got it figured out now
*Pro tip: No need to wait for middle age, younger members!
I truly believe that not worrying about what other people think of us is one of the great gifts of middle age* - even for those of us who always (more or less) played by the rules. I find the less I worry about what other people think, the more fascinating they seem to find me. One day I was on the way to the dog park, with my hair totally unkempt, wearing the kind of wardrobe you'd only put on for the dog park, when the cutest young ultra-chic urban teenagers stopped me and said, "excuse me, ma'am, I really like your outfit." Go figure! So I'm just going with it now - not just on the appearance level, either. Though I'm cherishing the mental image of you in your Talbot's style and inner tie-dye.
I was a very shy kid, and even after I outgrew it, I had shy 'habits' in the way I thought of myself. But I think I've got it figured out now
*Pro tip: No need to wait for middle age, younger members!
Oops, p.s.:
I meant to post about Djokovic and diet: It has been a subject of huge fascination, because his story crosses so many of the media threads that grab attention: health, diet, sports, weird-crazy-gluten-phobes. If you Google Djokovic, one of the first matches Google suggests (at least the way I use the Chrome browser, and I've probably trained it to obsess about gluten) is 'Djokovic diet' - and those results include sports sites, the Wall St. Journal, Forbes mag., as well as various health sites. One of those includes the subtitle "should you go gluten-free?" and I'll bet you anything they warn against it, because of all the miraculous nutrients in wheat... other than fiber, the only one they mention is that some grains are *fortified* with calcium - that's right, they don't actually contain that nutrient, but it might be added. They're calling it "the new low-carb." Don't read the article, I stopped when I got to the paragraph about people 'pretending to have celiac disease' - oops, I'm out of family-friendly language now. Rant narrowly averted...
xox/S
I meant to post about Djokovic and diet: It has been a subject of huge fascination, because his story crosses so many of the media threads that grab attention: health, diet, sports, weird-crazy-gluten-phobes. If you Google Djokovic, one of the first matches Google suggests (at least the way I use the Chrome browser, and I've probably trained it to obsess about gluten) is 'Djokovic diet' - and those results include sports sites, the Wall St. Journal, Forbes mag., as well as various health sites. One of those includes the subtitle "should you go gluten-free?" and I'll bet you anything they warn against it, because of all the miraculous nutrients in wheat... other than fiber, the only one they mention is that some grains are *fortified* with calcium - that's right, they don't actually contain that nutrient, but it might be added. They're calling it "the new low-carb." Don't read the article, I stopped when I got to the paragraph about people 'pretending to have celiac disease' - oops, I'm out of family-friendly language now. Rant narrowly averted...
xox/S
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Sheila
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- Joined: Wed May 18, 2011 5:10 am
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small world
I had lunch today with old friends, from a former life, remembering our youth. We met at a Panera Bread and, of course, I couldn't eat anything. I checked it out about an hour before I left home and ate something at home. I'm learning! I mentioned that I am on a GF diet and one friend said that she had been on a GF diet for 1 1/2 years but no longer. As it turned out, she thought she had MC, was tested and did not have it. She had the same symptoms, lost 35 lbs, couldn't leave the house, etc. She put herself on the GF diet after coming to THIS site many, many times. She never joined because she felt she had nothing to contribute but she got a world of good info here. Eventually, the D subsided and she is back to normal and no longer GF. BTW, her doctor told her she should just stick to her regular diet. Good thing she ignored him and listened to this group of informed people. It is such a small world and she is so very lucky.
As a child, I wasn't allowed out of the house unless I was "dressed". It could be play clothes but they matched and fit properly. When I was a teenager I never left the house without my hair being "done", make up on, and dressed "appropriately". That didn't stop me from skipping school and sneaking smokes. You can't tell a book by it's cover. I love the idea of the kids being impressed by your outfit. I wish I had the guts to do that. Old habits die hard. I love my jeans but even they are pretty proper, except for the skinny ones that are the most comfortable. It is hard to get my husband out of his jeans and he could not care less if he is under dressed. I like that about him most of the time.
Quinoa salad does not seem to be happy inside me. I guess the raw tomato, cucumber, scallions etc are just too much. Too bad, it's tasty. I was told not to eat salads and raw veggies but just had to try it.
Sheila
I mentioned that I am on a GF diet and one friend said that she had been on a GF diet for 1 1/2 years but no longer. As it turned out, she thought she had MC, was tested and did not have it. She had the same symptoms, lost 35 lbs, couldn't leave the house, etc. She put herself on the GF diet after coming to THIS site many, many times. She never joined because she felt she had nothing to contribute but she got a world of good info here. Eventually, the D subsided and she is back to normal and no longer GF. BTW, her doctor told her she should just stick to her regular diet. Good thing she ignored him and listened to this group of informed people. It is such a small world and she is so very lucky.As a child, I wasn't allowed out of the house unless I was "dressed". It could be play clothes but they matched and fit properly. When I was a teenager I never left the house without my hair being "done", make up on, and dressed "appropriately". That didn't stop me from skipping school and sneaking smokes. You can't tell a book by it's cover. I love the idea of the kids being impressed by your outfit. I wish I had the guts to do that. Old habits die hard. I love my jeans but even they are pretty proper, except for the skinny ones that are the most comfortable. It is hard to get my husband out of his jeans and he could not care less if he is under dressed. I like that about him most of the time.
Quinoa salad does not seem to be happy inside me. I guess the raw tomato, cucumber, scallions etc are just too much. Too bad, it's tasty. I was told not to eat salads and raw veggies but just had to try it.
Sheila
To get something you never had, you have to do something you never did.
A person who never made a mistake never tried something new. Einstein
A person who never made a mistake never tried something new. Einstein
Sheila, that's funny about looking proper and being just however you happen to be ;) My husband either looks like a million bucks in a suit, or (much more often these days) like a man who's forgotten why the comb was invented, with a t-shirt for his favorite radio station and shorts, or sporting gear (if it can be made out of recycled soda bottles, he's probably worn it). People who meet him in one mode often don't recognize him in the other! We have a family wedding this weekend, so he'll be breaking out the suit. Oops, I meant to head out an hour ago to buy a pair of shoes for this event! I am way off purpose today.
Perhaps when your friend was able to get her symptoms under control with diet, and maybe that's why the testing didn't show she had it - which I hope she doesn't, though she might have some other (less severe) flavor of gluten sensitivity. It is rare, but I was actually diagnosed in 1997, and after months of misery, it mysteriously went away on its own till March of this year. Luckily, your friend knows where to turn if her symptoms resurface - and I fondly hope that they do not. I knew nothing about the diet connection at the time (nor did my doctor, of course), and sometimes it makes me sad to think how much healthier I'd be today if I'd been GF all this time. But there's not much joy down that line of thinking!
Quinoa doesn't agree with me, I think. I haven't retried it in a while. It "should" be OK, because it isn't a true grain, but I had very grain-like symptoms. It can also elevate histamine in the body, which is a likely issue for me (so I haven't put it back on my list to re-test, at least not for now). I'm able to tolerate some raw veggies now - not the enormous salads I used to indulge in.
I had a couscous-like GF product on my vacation - a combination of rice and corn flour. It would make a nice version of that quinoa dish... if and when you can get the raw veggies back in your diet! I think I'm going to try a few weeks truly grain free. It's a good time of year for a variety of foods.
How nice that you were able to eat out with friends, despite the challenges... I hope the quinoa effects are a thing of the past soon, if not already!
--Sara
Perhaps when your friend was able to get her symptoms under control with diet, and maybe that's why the testing didn't show she had it - which I hope she doesn't, though she might have some other (less severe) flavor of gluten sensitivity. It is rare, but I was actually diagnosed in 1997, and after months of misery, it mysteriously went away on its own till March of this year. Luckily, your friend knows where to turn if her symptoms resurface - and I fondly hope that they do not. I knew nothing about the diet connection at the time (nor did my doctor, of course), and sometimes it makes me sad to think how much healthier I'd be today if I'd been GF all this time. But there's not much joy down that line of thinking!
Quinoa doesn't agree with me, I think. I haven't retried it in a while. It "should" be OK, because it isn't a true grain, but I had very grain-like symptoms. It can also elevate histamine in the body, which is a likely issue for me (so I haven't put it back on my list to re-test, at least not for now). I'm able to tolerate some raw veggies now - not the enormous salads I used to indulge in.
I had a couscous-like GF product on my vacation - a combination of rice and corn flour. It would make a nice version of that quinoa dish... if and when you can get the raw veggies back in your diet! I think I'm going to try a few weeks truly grain free. It's a good time of year for a variety of foods.
How nice that you were able to eat out with friends, despite the challenges... I hope the quinoa effects are a thing of the past soon, if not already!
--Sara
Sara,Sara wrote:Quinoa doesn't agree with me, I think. I haven't retried it in a while. It "should" be OK, because it isn't a true grain, but I had very grain-like symptoms. It can also elevate histamine in the body,
Where did you read that quinoa can elevate histamine in the body? Note that I'm hoping you're wrong.
Gloria
You never know what you can do until you have to do it.
Gloria,
Let's call me wrong, then. I will try to reconstruct my path to that idea. I may have leaped to a conclusion - I had a bad quinoa experience in the first couple of weeks, but I was so digestively upside down, honestly, it could have been anything. And I was unbelievably brain-fogged when I first found my way to this wonderful forum. I knew it at the time, but I only reaaalllly knew it when it started to lift.
Let us suppose that I am mistaken, yes? I find it very hard to believe that it's not working for you, with your meticulous records and methodical approach. That is what I need to do next: back to very few foods, stability, and good record-keeping as I add foods. I'm feeling pretty good, but not back to where I was before the trip. It's hard to fit that in right now, but it won't ever be easy, so...
I would bet that, as a plant nerd, I associated quinoa with spinach, because they are in the same plant family. That *can* indicate potential problems -but since many of us cannot tolerate iceberg but do OK with romaine lettuce, I am humbled to realize that even the same genus and *species* can have different effects, depending on the variety.
And, perhaps, I genuinely have a reaction to quinoa, so now I suspect it of all kinds of things ;)
I'm hoping I'm wrong, too, with all my heart!
Sara
Let's call me wrong, then. I will try to reconstruct my path to that idea. I may have leaped to a conclusion - I had a bad quinoa experience in the first couple of weeks, but I was so digestively upside down, honestly, it could have been anything. And I was unbelievably brain-fogged when I first found my way to this wonderful forum. I knew it at the time, but I only reaaalllly knew it when it started to lift.
Let us suppose that I am mistaken, yes? I find it very hard to believe that it's not working for you, with your meticulous records and methodical approach. That is what I need to do next: back to very few foods, stability, and good record-keeping as I add foods. I'm feeling pretty good, but not back to where I was before the trip. It's hard to fit that in right now, but it won't ever be easy, so...
I would bet that, as a plant nerd, I associated quinoa with spinach, because they are in the same plant family. That *can* indicate potential problems -but since many of us cannot tolerate iceberg but do OK with romaine lettuce, I am humbled to realize that even the same genus and *species* can have different effects, depending on the variety.
And, perhaps, I genuinely have a reaction to quinoa, so now I suspect it of all kinds of things ;)
I'm hoping I'm wrong, too, with all my heart!
Sara