Monumental doctors appointment!!!!

Feel free to discuss any topic of general interest, so long as nothing you post here is likely to be interpreted as insulting, and/or inflammatory, nor clearly designed to provoke any individual or group. Please be considerate of others feelings, and they will be considerate of yours.

Moderators: Rosie, Stanz, Jean, CAMary, moremuscle, JFR, Dee, xet, Peggy, Matthew, Gabes-Apg, grannyh, Gloria, Mars, starfire, Polly, Joefnh

User avatar
Zizzle
King Penguin
King Penguin
Posts: 3492
Joined: Thu Jul 22, 2010 9:47 am

Monumental doctors appointment!!!!

Post by Zizzle »

I'm usually fairly brief and blunt, so apologies for the long post….

I had my long-awaited appointment with an integrative medicine doctor on Monday afternoon, and I have to say, I am overwhelmed with feelings of relief, gratitude, fear and worry all at the same time. He's not a gastroenterologist, he's a Doctor of Osteopathy who specializes in pain medicine and treating chronic conditions with a number of different modalities, both regular and complementary/alternative. He also happens to be one of the favorite docs of the celiac community in my area, and a specialist in treating Ehler-Danlos Syndrome.

I was there for more than 2 hours and spent the better part of an hour going over my medical history from birth. His questions guided me in directions I hadn't pondered in years (like my kidney infection at age 3), and yet it all made so much sense. I was an international development brat who moved every 2 years throughout my childhood, back and forth from Latin American countries to the US. With every move, or with my annual visits to Guatemala, I had infectious gastroenteritis on a regular basis (at least once a year throughout my childhood). I even had worms (common in kids overseas). Frequent UTIs in adolescence and prophylactic antibiotics when going to the dentist for Mitral Valve Prolapse made me a frequent antibiotic user (despite seemingly good health). All this resulted in multiple assaults on my GI system and my DNA over the years -- this laid the foundation for my immune system dysfunction.

I asked why Latin Americans don't get AI diseases in their countries like we do, and he explained their bodies adapt to their surrounding bacteria. With all my travels, my body could never adapt. It was multiple assaults instead. In fact, my IBS started after a severe GI illness in Guatemala (probably Hep A). And the lactose intolerance became severe after a GI bug in Thailand. My doc joked, "Why did you go to Southeast Asia for your honeymoon? Because you hadn't traveled enough?!"

Throw in a pregnancy and prolactin-filled postpartum period with 4 bouts of mastitis and antibiotics, and it's no wonder my body and skin freaked out.

But wait, throw in my HLA DQ2 gene and my newly diagnosed Ehler Danlos Syndrome (Joint Hypermobility Syndrome), and you've got a connective tissue disaster on your hands.

Yup, I am officially diagnosed with celiac disease and EDS now (although not in my insurance records - in case I want more life insurance, etc). Regarding my negative celiac bloodwork 6 years ago, he explained gluten intolerance is a spectrum disease, with me fairly high up on the spectrum. He said my immediate, drastic improvement on the GF diet, and my severe symptoms after gluten rechallenge, combined with my obvious autoimmune involvement, are enough proof that I have celiac, and not a mere sensitivity. Regarding EDS, he could spot it from a mile away. My soft skin, my bruising, my crazy joints, MVP, etc. This condition I wondered about since my teens, the one that no parent or doctor ever cared to look for, explains so many crazy symptoms that have plagued me all my life. Hips and shoulders popping out of the sockets, scoliosis, pelvic separation during pregnancy, bleeding under my skin when I scratch a bug bite, etc. I wanted to cry. I did this morning. He also explained that more than 20% of his EDS patients have celiac, so there seems to be a connection there too, although he has a skewed sample given his specialty.

But that's not all!! My dermographia (skin writing), low blood pressure, and hives during exercise point to abnormal mast cell degranulation. And while I don't have full-blown POTS, I do have abnormal autonomic nervous system response (something I've always suspected too). The hammer test against one knee showed a slightly abnormal myoclonus response, which when combined with my restless legs and benign tremor, points to magnesium deficiency (I think). He said magnesium deficiency was virtually guaranteed given the long-term diarrhea.

Interestingly, he was not that focused on the LC/MC. It seemed to be a symptom of the larger set of problems, namely the celiac and gut permeability, in his mind. I was OK with that.

So, was there any good news? He said I am very lucky that I don't have neurologic damage from gluten -- no peripheral neuropathy, no headaches, no ataxia, etc. He has many celiac patients who only present with neurologic issues, no GI involvement. He said I will also age without wrinkles because of the EDS. I was suspect, given I have some wrinkles already, but they appeared after losing 10 lbs this year (which he said he sees all the time when people adopt the GF diet). So I'm hopeful. Incidentally, my 69 yr-old mother has no wrinkles, just saggy cheeks. She has my translucent, soft skin. And she had 2 brain bleeds (subacute subdural hematomas) recently. It's clear where I got my EDS gene…

He ordered a bunch of tests -- complete stool analysis, gluten-associated cross-reactive food sensitivities, intracellular magnesium level, and intestinal permeability screen. More details on those below. I follow up in 3 weeks.

So here I am, with a bunch of concrete, confident answers to questions that have plagued me forever. Things that I studied at nauseum wondering if they might apply to me -- now I have an expert telling me they do. At one point I joked, "Now you can see why I'm a hypochondriac." He answered, "You're not a hypochondriac, you are extremely well-read. You've done your diligence. But we have to do things one step at a time". When I asked if I have an autoimmune disease (besides celiac), he answered "Yes." I asked, "but which one?" He answered "we don't want to put a name on it, we want to put the brakes on it so we don't ever have to name it." This is PRECISELY the type of predictive, preventive medicine I was hoping for.

So I think I'm happy and relieved for myself. I think I will take a leap of faith and let this doctor take care of me for a change. I need a vacation from being my own disease detective. :wink: I am assured that once I have a treatment plan, much of the follow-up can be conducted by my in-network primary care physician. And they even have a local gastroenterologist who they highly recommend!!

As far as my kids go, that's another story. I strongly suspect they have EDS too, and I'm wondering what, if any, follow-up they might require. If my case is Type II-III and mild, will theirs be the same? My hubby drew a line in the sand about gluten intolerance tonight. My son was complaining of stomach pains and had diarrhea and suggested it might be gluten. My husband exclaimed, "you are 7 years old and have no reason to be worrying about things like gluten. You're fine." Fun times ahead!!


For your reference, here are the tests ordered by my doctor. Given how much this is costing me, I am skipping the new MRT test this year.


Genova Diagnostics CDSA 2.0 (stool analysis)
http://www.gdx.net/product/10006

Intracellular magnesium level (from cells scraped from under my tongue)

Cyrex Labs tests:

http://www.cyrexlabs.com/CyrexTestsArra ... fault.aspx

Intestinal Antigenic Permeability Screen
Includes:
Actomyosin IgA
Occludin/Zonulin IgG
Occludin/Zonulin IgA
Occludin/Zonulin IgM
Lipopolysaccharides (LPS) IgG
Lipopolysaccharides (LPS) IgA
Lipopolysaccharides (LPS) IgM

Gluten-Associated Cross-Reactive Foods and Foods Sensitivity
Includes:
Cow’s Milk IgG + IgA Combined ( CPT CODE : 86256 )
Alpha-Casein & Beta-Casein IgG + IgA Combined ( CPT CODE : 86256-59 )
Casomorphin IgG + IgA Combined ( CPT CODE : 86256-59 )
Milk Butyrophilin IgG + IgA Combined ( CPT CODE : 86256-59 )
American Cheese IgG + IgA Combined ( CPT CODE : 86256-59 )
Chocolate (Milk) IgG + IgA Combined ( CPT CODE : 86256-59 )
Sorghum IgG + IgA Combined ( CPT CODE : 86256-59 )
Millet IgG + IgA Combined ( CPT CODE : 86256-59 )
Spelt IgG + IgA Combined ( CPT CODE : 86256-59 )
Amaranth IgG + IgA Combined ( CPT CODE : 86256-59 )
Quinoa IgG + IgA Combined ( CPT CODE : 86256-59 )
Yeast IgG + IgA Combined ( CPT CODE : 86256-59 )
Sesame IgG + IgA Combined ( CPT CODE : 86256-59 )
Hemp IgG + IgA Combined ( CPT CODE : 86256-59 )
Rye IgG + IgA Combined ( CPT CODE : 86256-59 )
Barley IgG + IgA Combined ( CPT CODE : 86256-59 )
Polish Wheat IgG + IgA Combined ( CPT CODE : 86256-59 )
Buckwheat IgG + IgA Combined ( CPT CODE : 86256-59 )
Tapioca IgG + IgA Combined ( CPT CODE : 86256-59 )
Oats IgG + IgA Combined ( CPT CODE : 86256-59 )
Coffee IgG + IgA Combined ( CPT CODE : 86256-59 )
Corn IgG + IgA Combined ( CPT CODE : 86256-59 )
Rice IgG + IgA Combined ( CPT CODE : 86256-59 )
Potato IgG + IgA Combined ( CPT CODE : 86256-59 )


:vacationsign:
starfire
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 5198
Joined: Wed May 25, 2005 5:48 am
Location: Pennsylvania

Post by starfire »

Wow!!! I am amazed. It must be tough absorbing all that information. I can certainly understand your conflicting emotions.
:grouphug:

Love, Shirley
When the eagles are silent, the parrots begin to jabber"
-- Winston Churchill
User avatar
draperygoddess
Rockhopper Penguin
Rockhopper Penguin
Posts: 558
Joined: Mon Aug 29, 2011 6:49 am
Location: Tennessee

Post by draperygoddess »

Zizzle,

WOW! That is quite a laundry list! I am so glad you found a doctor whom you can trust, because that is just too much for one person to handle alone. Also glad to hear that he's more concerned with getting you well than putting a label on what you have or don't have. Sounds like the best possible scenario.

As far as your family goes, I think it's sometimes scary to think that not just one, but possibly several of your family members might have a problem this difficult to get a handle on. Maybe this is what your husband is feeling. When my sister started showing symptoms of epilepsy at 10, she practically had to beg my mother to take her to the doctor. Mother was scared to death the doctor would tell her Jacquelyn had a brain tumor, and not knowing was preferable to bad news. Of course, once she was diagnosed and controlled with medication, it seemed silly that she didn't see a doctor before. As you learn how to handle your issues successfully, maybe he will come around. AND, there's nothing to say you can't track your children's symptoms yourself and see if there's a pattern. Annual well-child check-ups can be a wonderful thing! :wink:

Hope you are enjoying your "vacation" and are feeling better than you have in years!!
Cynthia

"Can we fix it? YES WE CAN!" -Bob the Builder
Kari
Rockhopper Penguin
Rockhopper Penguin
Posts: 1346
Joined: Sun Sep 05, 2010 4:26 pm
Location: Colorado

Post by Kari »

Wow Zizzle - that's quite a lot of information from one visit. It sounds very promising, and I'm so happy for you that you've finally found someone you can trust with your health. You certainly have been a relentless researcher, and have been kind to share the results of your labor with us here. I've been expecting you to come through with a major break-through at any time :grin: .

It makes so much sense to me when someone takes a holistic view of the person they are trying to help, but I think those "true healers" are few and far between, so it sounds like you've really lucked out - yeah!!!

Enjoy your research vacation - it's well deserved :grin: . As time goes by, I'm sure your DH will come around.

Love,
Kari
"My mouth waters whenever I pass a bakery shop and sniff the aroma of fresh bread, but I am also grateful simply to be alive and sniffing." Dr. Bernstein
User avatar
Zizzle
King Penguin
King Penguin
Posts: 3492
Joined: Thu Jul 22, 2010 9:47 am

Post by Zizzle »

Wow, this story about a Canadian teen trying to seek medical care in the US for EDS makes me thankful I was able to find a doctor in my same town, and thankful I don't have a more severe form of EDS. I hope my luck continues, and she gets the care she needs. I signed her petition!

http://www.thestar.com/news/article/1078284
User avatar
Lesley
King Penguin
King Penguin
Posts: 2920
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2011 11:13 pm
Contact:

Post by Lesley »

Zizzle,

I, like all the others, am blown away by your story. The doc sounds fantastic. It's been a long time since I have encountered a doc like that.

I am so glad you found someone to help you, and to find all your sensitivities. I am sure your hubby is very anxious, and doesn't want to believe either that you are ill, or, even more so, your kids.
`
User avatar
sarkin
Rockhopper Penguin
Rockhopper Penguin
Posts: 2313
Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2011 8:44 pm
Location: Brooklyn, NY

Post by sarkin »

WOW, Z, what relief you must be feeling, in a mixed-feelings sort of way. I love your doctor's approach of not looking for a name, but for preventing the issue... Congratulations on finding a kindred spirit, and enjoy your well-earned break.

Sounds as though your son inherited your research-oriented gene, along with (alas) risk for gluten sensitivity. Hope he's not heading down the familiar road we all share (or at least not now, not soon, and not fast!). I'm sure Kari & Lesley are right, and if it comes down to it, and gluten 'falls' off your son's menu as well, he'll be more than committed to his long-term health. (How great if he never has to undergo the research you've been undertaking!)

Thanks for the detailed update - I look forward to the next chapter of this story,

S
User avatar
Gabes-Apg
Emperor Penguin
Emperor Penguin
Posts: 8367
Joined: Mon Dec 21, 2009 3:12 pm
Location: Hunter Valley NSW Australia

Post by Gabes-Apg »

Woo Hoo Zizzle

finding a doctor that 'gets it' and looks at your whole health history is definately worthy of a long post - and the comprehensive nature of the tests will give good quality answers (more so than blood tests)

I have recently found a naturopath who
a) has gluten and yeast intolerance so he totally understand whole of body reactions; and
b) who is registering as a GP to focus on 'environmental medicine' which appears to be similar to your doctor. He will look at all childhood health, work and living environments, in our first appointment he mentioned he would like to do some tests, and a couple of them sound similar to the ones you listed.
He agrees that proactive management is a definate for these types of conditions, and will support regular monitoring of key items (Vit B, Vit D etc)
(not at my cost....)

our program has been interupted a bit by some new symptoms that have appeared - at this stage they are not digestion related, and are requiring quite a bit of investigation.
I do have my Vit D result which i am very happy to report I have gone from 21.6 ng/ml (feb 2011) to 64 ng/ml (woo hoo!)
Gabes Ryan

"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned"
Dalai Lama
User avatar
Lesley
King Penguin
King Penguin
Posts: 2920
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2011 11:13 pm
Contact:

Post by Lesley »

And you get that with your insurance Gabes? I think I should come to Oz! Exactly what I need, since my doc is such a neanderthal (someone else said that, not me!)

Glad you are doing better. I hope the new symptoms are nothing to worry about.
User avatar
Joefnh
Rockhopper Penguin
Rockhopper Penguin
Posts: 2478
Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2010 8:25 pm
Location: Southern New Hampshire

Post by Joefnh »

Hi Zizzle what an appointment! Anytime we can put the pieces of the health puzzle together is a great day. I'm so glad you found that doctor and that he is able to think outside of the box and look at the whole picture.

Keep up up to date on this, it's both great and interesting news.

Joe
Joe
garina
Gentoo Penguin
Gentoo Penguin
Posts: 263
Joined: Tue Mar 29, 2011 8:59 pm
Location: Florida

Post by garina »

Zizzle,

Oh, what a great doctor you've found. He sounds very thorough and knowledgeable. It gives me encouragement to continue seeking an equally good doctor wherever he/she may be who understands MC.

I hope you post more of your treatment plan ... I'll be watching.

My best,

garnia
User avatar
Zizzle
King Penguin
King Penguin
Posts: 3492
Joined: Thu Jul 22, 2010 9:47 am

Post by Zizzle »

Well, I have to report that my feelings of relief, gratitude, fear and worry had been replaced by anger and overwhelming sorrow today. I drowned my sorrow in a bowl of Vietnamese Pho with the kids this evening, but then I cried the whole way home. :cry:

I'm angry about the EDS. I'm angry that I spent so many years visiting doctors and chiropractors for recurrent back, neck, hip and knee issues, and no one ever suggested EDS. I'm angry that my rheumatologist 7 years ago noted "joint hypermobility syndrome" in my chart, but never explained it to me. I saw it Monday when searching through my medical records. I'm angry that no one warned me of what could happen in my pregnancies -- that I would suffer debilitating, excruciating pelvic separation pain, that my water would break 3 weeks early with my son, that the kids would come flying out of me in record time (despite warnings that my pelvis might be too small :roll:). I'm angry that my feet hurt in anything but the most orthopedic of shoes, to the dismay of my stylish husband. I'm angry that I've never been able to sit indian-style without my joints locking up and my butt hurting and falling asleep. I'm angry that my blood pressure, heart rate and related issues had an explanation, after all these years of bewilderment.

Most of all, I'm sorrowful for the girl I used to be. The girl who worked harder than everyone on the team in basketball and track, but who couldn't keep up during distance runs, who hyperventilated and cramped up on the basketball court, despite being the most flexible one on the team. The girl who looked beaten and bruised from the waist down, suffering dizzy spells all the time, without a clue as to why I was so different. I had unrelenting knee, hip and low back pains, sciatica, deep throbbing skeletal pains, ocular migraines, heart palpitations, and cracking popping joints.

I read about EDS, but it sounded so severe. So I wasted my time reading about Mitral Valve Prolapse Syndrome, vitamin deficiencies, you name it, trying to explain what was happening to me. Why didn't I figure it out?!? I feel like such a fool.

Obviously things will be different for my kids. I'll be on top of the situation, whatever the situation may be.
I feel so much sorrow, but I keep having to remind myself that none of this is serious. It's not like I was just diagnosed with cancer. These are nuisance conditions, for the most part. I need to be grateful that I know before any long-term effects of EDS start to become apparent.

Phew! Ok, I feel better (for now). Thanks for listening!
Sheila
Rockhopper Penguin
Rockhopper Penguin
Posts: 1150
Joined: Wed May 18, 2011 5:10 am
Location: Palm Beach Gardens, Fl

Post by Sheila »

It is so interesting to find that all of those seemingly disconnected illnesses, anti-biotics, different environments etc all add up to what you are today and someone diagnosed you correctly. You are fortunate to have found someone so knowledgeable and interested in your entire person.

Your story makes me look back at things I had forgotten about from my childhood. I had a terrible itchy rash on my legs that was never identified or treated, a relentless sinus/cough problem, a "nervous" stomach, recurrent serious infections one of which required a penicillin shot every other day. Shows you how old I am!!! :grin:

It is good to hear such a wonderful success story.
Sheila
To get something you never had, you have to do something you never did.

A person who never made a mistake never tried something new. Einstein
User avatar
Gabes-Apg
Emperor Penguin
Emperor Penguin
Posts: 8367
Joined: Mon Dec 21, 2009 3:12 pm
Location: Hunter Valley NSW Australia

Post by Gabes-Apg »

Zizzle

I hear ya! (and vent away)
i have felt the same this week. 4 weeks ago i was celebrating MC in remission (with a bit of caution)
then a week later there are new symptoms and health issues and i am feeling like .."come on give me a break" and "why does there have to be more challenges"
and i have another medical professional classing me as 'an interesting complex case' i dont want to be interesting and/or complex.... I crave uncomplicated!!!
Gabes Ryan

"Anything that contradicts experience and logic should be abandoned"
Dalai Lama
Sheila
Rockhopper Penguin
Rockhopper Penguin
Posts: 1150
Joined: Wed May 18, 2011 5:10 am
Location: Palm Beach Gardens, Fl

Post by Sheila »

It's okay to bitch about it, too. :grin:
Sheila
To get something you never had, you have to do something you never did.

A person who never made a mistake never tried something new. Einstein
Post Reply

Return to “Main Message Board”