Calling Gabes...

[Lesley]

Gabes - what did you mean, in the post to Althea, by ALL the proteins? There are so many I can't eat.
I have difficulty with finding light things to eat when I don't feel great. No chicken, so no soup, no eggs, no dairy. So I am left with the heavy meats and, thankfully, white fish - right now tilapia. That makes a lot of heavier stuff with no light relief.

My budget has been blown out of the water, because I have switched to grass fed meats, which are expensive. Especially after the report today that red meat will kill you quickly I feel even more strongly about this. If I could, as I used to, eat it once a day, with eggs, dairy and salad for the rest, I could manage, but it's this 3 times a day thing that is doing me in.

Right now I have been directed away from potatoes (and I understand that I must lay off a bit so I don't develop a sensitivity to them) towards grains, so I am trying a few that tested low for me. After 6 months I am still so far from finding out what will allow me to get on top of this thing.

[Gabes-Apg]

Lesley
i am very blessed in Aus that red meat is quite affordable, I make a savory stew type thing using finely chopped beef, lamb and veal, with lots of grated vegs (gabe safe ones) in it, plus my home made stock and slow cook it for about 8 hours.

Seafood is affordable and easy to access (numerous outlets on my drive home from work), so i can have fresh seafood a few times a week. (dory or barramundi is about $5 per serve and Salmon is about $7 - $9 per serve)
i buy the gabe safe turkey which is the same price per kilo as fresh salmon, and I can tolerate chicken ok

i have basically stopped having eggs (histamines),
I have a rice protein powder that I started using about 6 months ago, i mix it with coconut milk (which would be my staple should i not have electricity as per marliss's other post)

the rice protein with the coconut milk is about $2.50 per serve. having that for one meal and one snack each day means i can afford the other proteins.

I look at the cost of things as the per meal costing. when i make a big batch of the stew, it works out about $5 per serve (meat and veges).
Pretty much most of my meals are cheaper than buying takeaway, and the times i have more expensive grass fed steak or salmon the meal cost is still cheaper than eating out.

gooey rice with chook and sweet pot is about $3 a serve.

Dont get me wrong, my food billl post MC is dearer than before diagnosis. Every week, i pour over the 'junk mail' to see which outlet has what things on special meat wise. (there are three major supermarket outlets i can access within 5 mins of home) just to save $5 - $10 each week.
but in comparison, i am not eating take-away or going out for lunches and dinners, i am not drinking alcohol, so if I equate what i used to spend on food and eating out/drinking - i am probably spending the same

Also - eating well, my digestion being happy means i am using less supplements. (which also saves me money)

[Lesley]

Right now if I were to buy regular meat (not grass fed) it would be way cheaper, but, given the difference in the known health benefits, and given that my cholesterol has dropped 50 points since I started eating only grass fed I won't stop. And eating it 3 times a day is very expensive.

Fish and seafood are also expensive here, though right now I am eating only tilapia (cheaper, but still $7.50 a lb, and farm raised) because of the MRT, which showed I can't have salmon.
Turkey and chicken are out for me )-;, as are rice and sweet potatoes, which I used to live on! So I have no protein powder I can use for shakes.
I tried hemp powder and found it disgusting and undrinkable. I wish I could do one meal with it. I used to love it. And there would be the lighter meal I am craving so much.
As for snacks - I have none.
I spend hours online looking for cheaper grass fed meats, and I bought a small freezer so I can get bulk to pay less. It's not easy.

I am now trying the grains the MRT said I could have, but I am having difficulty with them. I find them more difficult to eat than potatoes. Sort of heavier.

I never ate take away, and didn't eat out much. Breakfast with Adam on the weekends, usually he bought. Now if I go with him he eats, I watch.

I make beef stock, but have to remake it because I used celery, which is now OUT for me as per the MRT. I can't have carrots yet, so I can't really make it.
I am also avoiding histamines. And I have home made bolognese made with my stock (delicious) which contains celery (no-no), and tomato puree (histamine) in it. So it goes to Adam.
I haven't cut down on supplements, though I am not taking them this week as per the MRT.

What's Chook?

Basically the light meal is what I really, really miss right now.

[Gabes-Apg]

chook is aussie slang meaning 'chicken'

my stock is meat based only, just chicken drumsticks and lamb bones, bit of salt.
I missed alot of the flavours at first but after about 9 months i got used to the taste of my food.

i would love to buy organic everything but i cant afford it, i think at first it is important to focus on getting the symptoms reduced, inflammation down and then look to expand the ingredients.

for 18 months i have been eating stew for lunch at work, summer and winter. mid week i have been having the coconut milk with rice protein or i just have chicken and rice to break the monotony
on hot summer days i miss salads and fruit.

[MBombardier]

Lesley, if you can eat cod, Trader Joe's has it for $3.99/lb., though I noticed some packages said $6.99/lb. My 17yo pointed out that cod is a bottom-feeder, but we cannot afford salmon at $8.99. I like cod because I can wrap frozen fillets in aluminum foil with some coconut oil, onions, and spices, stick it in the oven, and it is done in about the time it takes to cook some vegetables.

About salmon: My D-I-L told me that unless the salmon says that it was wild-caught in Alaska, it could actually be farmed. Alaska has a law that if it says it is wild-caught in Alaska, it actually is.

[Lesley]

I don't buy organic veggies. Mostly they are overpriced for no reason. The only thing I am concentrating on is grass fed meat.
I am HAPPY to eat less of the meat but better quality, if I could find something else to eat. I would love to fill up on something else. I am always looking for something. I buy veggies at Costco when I can, if I think I can finish them, or share. If I could make anything significantly filling with veggies I would skip the meat happily for 2 meals a day.

Marliss - I have some of that cod in my freezer. I think I can eat it. Not doing it now because of trying to adhere to the MRT, but I will do it soon. When I bought it was $3.99. Maybe I should go get some more.
I also like to do it wrapped. The other fish I like to do is rainbow trout, which I get from Costco (2.99 a lb, but with heads and tails, so about the same as the cod). They sell packets of 4. It's delicious done like that.

I am wondering if I could make a smoothie with millet. Cooked millet, with coconut milk and some flavorings. Hmmm! Maybe that can be breakfast?
I need to get back to oats. Those really helped. In a week or 2.

Oh, Marliss, BTW - cooked millet coated on tilapia (also bought at Costco out of the freezer - cheaper) and baked, is very good. The millet crisps and makes a nice coating.

And Gabes - tip for enriching the flavor of the stock: If you are peeling veggies put the peelings into a bag and freeze. Anything. I have even done apples. Add to them every time you peel. When you have enough add them to the bones and roast altogether. Then simmer. For hours. The stock is much better.

[Gabes-Apg]

Lesley
what i was thinking but didnt really say that well is , just do the best you can, so it doesnt cause stress on the budget and works with your lifestyle.
There are markets and places about 30 - 45min drive from here that do have stuff cheaper, but by the time you add in the petrol cost and my time, it doesnt work out that much cheaper...

i know you have lots of symptoms and health issues, and this can cloud the focus a bit trying to accommodate them all. if it was me i would focus on them one at a time. easier said than done i know. Stress can be our worst enemy so we have to at peace with our approach to what we are doing.

I didnt do enterolab or MRT, i figured out my least reactive foods via listening to my body. yes i was using acupuncture and over the course of 12 months i probably spent the same amount on acupuncture as you have spent on MRT testing.

for me, meals with no more than 4- 6 ingredients works best, that is why i have not added vege peelings to the stock prep process, that way i always have a plain base to work off.
I always keep about 3 litres (?3.5 quarts) of stock in my freezer, that way if I was to get sick i have enough supplies to be able to feed myself without having to ask someone to cook for me.

[Polly]

Hi Lesley,

Would you mind posting your MRT results in the MRT Results Forum? I know you mentioned them somewhere, but it would be easier to find them under MRT stuff. Also, what were your lowest "greens" (those recommended for weeks one and two)? I will eyeball your results and see if I can figure out any helpful suggestions for you based upon my own experience with MRT.

Hugs,

Polly

[tex]

Lesley,

Are you sure that you need to be spending extra money on organic meats? I certainly don't begrudge anyone eating organic food, if they really enjoy it, but I decided years ago that I couldn't find any reason to justify seeking it out. In general, the advantages of organic food are in the eye of the beholder. One of the biggest misconceptions surrounding it is that most of the people who believe in it, think that it's a "green" concept. It's not. In fact, it's about as ungreen as one can get. Most of the articles proclaiming it's advantages over food produced by conventional means, won't hold up to close scrutiny, (they're not impartial studies, they're promotional advertisements disguised as studies), and there are many, many studies that show no nutritional or other health advantages to organic food. Consider the following quotes from the Washington Times article at the link below:

But don’t the pesticides used on ordinary foods wreak havoc with human bodies? Not as far as science can tell us. Says Reason magazine’s online site, another study taking no less than 13 years and looking at no fewer than 90,000 farmers and their families — people who were practically snuggling with pesticides — came up with nothing scary. The cancer rates, it’s noted, were lower than in the population at large.

Growing organic food is supposedly kinder to land than growing food by ordinary means, but it consumes enormously more land per unit produced. One reported estimate is that no forests would be left if you tried to supply total human food needs this way, and that, even then, many would starve.

One of Reason magazine’s online pieces quotes a Cambridge chemist named John Emsley as saying, “The greatest catastrophe that the human race could face this century is not global warming, but a global conversion to organic farming — an estimated 2 billion people would perish.”

None of which means I oppose people spending their hard-earned money on organic foods because, if nothing else, they thereby help to support a $14 billion industry. I myself am not against big corporations. I think they are good for America.

What does burn me are exhortations that the rest of humanity observe such otherwise meaningless rituals as some sort of salvation from a modern age seen as mostly evil even when it has offered so many blessings to humankind and when poverty and misery would almost certainly accompany a non-fertilizer, non-pesticide, non-biotech agricultural system if it were the only show in town.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/200 ... ed_stories

Tex

[Lesley]

Thanks to you all!

Gabes: I am concentrating on my digestive tract. Nothing else is taking my energy. I have totally stopped pain pills, so I am in a lot of pain from my back a lot of the time, and am not doing much as a result. The reason I stopped them is because of the harm they did to my digestive tract. I have been hoping for C relief, but not yet. I thought I would have massive D, but no...I always do things not quite as expected.

Stock: I was only referring to the veggies safe for you. I know I can't use celery anymore, so my peels will have to be discarded. Now that I have to give my lovely stock to a friend, who will be more than delighted I take your point about not adding anything.

Polly: I will go over there and post my results when I get it on the computer from Meg.
Meantime, the lowest greens are: goat's milk ( I KNEW that I could eat it!), cottage cheese (can't have it), cayenne pepper, mint, olive, papaya, grape (can't do it) pear, onion, tomato (can't), green pepper (ditto), spinach, cabbage, amarynth, barley (obviously can't) millet, tilapia, catfish, clam, turkey (can't), lamb, tea, yeast, peanut, lentil, sunflower seed.


Tex: I don't buy ORGANIC anything, except when organic produce costs the same or cheaper than non organic. Grass fed is not the same as organic. Means that cows aren't fed every darn thing under the sun, things that they are NOT meant to digest. When they are fed all that crap their systems work about the same as mine does when I feed it gluten, and their meat is far from healthy for us, especially when you have a sick digestive system.
Paleo man lived on grass grazing meats, and got everything they needed from them. The key is grass grazing.
When my doctor asked for a cholesterol test for me she was blown away that my number had dropped so significantly. Reading literature about the grass fed meats, I wasn't. I was glad, but not surprised because I was hoping that the literature was correct.

[tex]

Lesley,

I certainly won't argue that grass fed beef isn't healthier than grain fed beef. I believe it is healthier. I think it's way overpriced, (grass is cheap,compared with grain), but part of the cost is interest on the investment, since it takes longer to produce beef on grass, (or course, interest is cheap, these days), and the market is much smaller, so it's more of a hassle for producers to deal with.

I would argue that the bovine digestive system is designed to digest virtually any type of plant material, however, including grain. The part of plants that's the most difficult to digest, is the cellulose in plant stems. Cattle can digest cellulose, but humans can't. Even humans can digest grain, so digesting grain is a piece of cake, for cattle. It's not like they're eating poison, grain is just much more fattening than grass.

Tex

[Lesley]

I know that they can eat grain, but the grain is genetically modified so that is what we get in our meat (apart from the fattening issue). Also they are fed all sorts of waste and candy and sugar. All that makes the meat deemed unhealthy for us. And given my health problems right now I feel I can't afford to make more dietary mistakes.

The reason the farmers feed the cattle only grass and hay is because of the genetically modified issue. I spent a long time talking to one of them at the farmers market, after I pumped my brother (professor of physiology) on the subject. He mocked me at first, but then went into researching the subject (because he loves me) and came back to tell me he thinks I am doing the right thing.

I also think it's overpriced, but that's supply and demand.
Unless I get a really good deal, or it's a celebration, I don't buy the expensive cuts of meat. Can't, tempting as they are. If I buy bulk with my friend we both get a few steaks, but it's mostly ground, stewing meat and soup bones. Same with pork and lamb. So I mix the grounds to make a stew, burgers or meat loaf, and flavor it with the stock I make with the bones. And I eat it every day, right now 3 times a day. Or 2x with fish for one meal. With the grains that are safe for me, or potatoes.
Oh, and I just ordered liver and tongue with our next shipment. It's good and cheap and healthy to eat.

I wish I could eat chicken. I miss it so much!

[tex]

The reason the farmers feed the cattle only grass and hay is because of the genetically modified issue.

You're confusing economics and marketing strategy with political/moral principles. Actually, "the genetically modified issue" is the reason why you, (and many others), buy such meat. That's not why the farmers/ranchers produce it, however. They are in business, just like any other businessperson, and their livelihood depends on their bottom line. The reason why they produce grass fed beef is primarily because it pays better than producing conventional beef.

Tex

[Polly]

Interesting discussion. I try to get grass-fed beef and bison (the cheaper cuts) as much as possible. I like it, for one reason, because it has a higher amount of omega 3 fats. I am basically a frugal person (I drive a 10 year old Honda Civic, wear my clothes for years, and have never renovated my 35 year-old kitchen) BUT when it comes to my health and limited diet, I will splurge.

Love,

Polly

[Lesley]

Tex - which is why I talked to my brother, whose first response is to make fun of something like this. I plant the idea and let him wander off to research it on his own. When he came back with the news of (Polly) more omega 3s, and other vitamins (all the Bs) and minerals, saying that grass fed meat is different from corn fed and healthier, I was even more prepared to eat it in so far as is possible.
The other interesting piece of information is that a friend of his is researching red meats in general and their effects on health. He has come to the conclusion that lamb is way healthier than beef or bison. Why? Don't know yet. I have to get the full info from a book he is apparently writing.
BTW all NZ lamb is grass fed. Tastes way better than corn fed lamb. It's not local, but it's also relatively inexpensive and pretty good. I get it at Costco when they have it.
So the meat Gabes gets is grass fed by default!

I used to go to the major markets according to their sales, particularly meat. Now I scour the internet for info about grass fed meat deals, and buy with a friend to get bulk savings.

Polly, I am also frugal. My car is 8 years old, pretty beat up, but only has 42000 miles on the clock. I will probably drive it till I die. I don't have mani/pedis, I don't get my hair colored or more than a cut every couple of months, I hardly ever eat out, I barely go anywhere.

My diet is SO restricted and I am still suffering. I still haven't found my way to healing. I feel that everything I can do to get the best food possible into me has to be done.