Paleo Diet and ketosis

Sheila · Post by **Sheila** » Sun Jul 29, 2012 6:36 pm

Many years ago when I quit smoking I went on an extreme Atkins diet. I didn't lose weight but I did go into ketosis and got pretty sick. I was so weak I couldn't get off the sofa and with 2 small children to care for that wasn't acceptable.

I realized today that I have been feeling nauseous, tired and weak, a little wobbly for a while now. I wake up in the morning and in an hour or so, I'm sleeping in a chair. No energy. Today at lunch I was so nauseous I didn't want to eat but forced myself to have some turkey/rice soup. Still tired, no energy. For dinner I made a burger and decided, to heck with it, and had it on a Udi's hamburger bun along with roasted asparagus. After dinner, I have more energy, not nauseated. Still don't feel great but I'm wondering if I have been eating too much protein and not enough carbs. I have always eaten more carbs than meat and was a semi-vegetarian when I got sick. Meat just doesn't appeal to me much. I never had an issue with fatigue before MC even though I wasn't eating much meat.

So, anyone else have any issues with ketosis, feeling exhausted while on the Paleo diet, nauseous?

Sheila W

MBombardier · Post by **MBombardier** » Sun Jul 29, 2012 9:26 pm

There is something called the "low-carb flu." Some people have it worse than others. Some don't have it at all. It's the body adjusting to getting its carbs from protein sources instead of the easy carbs in grains, fruits, and sugars. It goes away. I'm not saying that is the problem, but it is a possibility. You may want to taper off the carbs slower to see if that helps, or if there something else going on.

Polly · Post by **Polly** » Mon Jul 30, 2012 7:37 am

Hiya Sheila!

Hmmmmm, what Marliss says is true. But I wonder if that's your problem? The standard paleo diet, I believe, has quite a bit of carbs, since it allows so many fruits/veggies. But I am a great believer in listening to your body. If you feel better with more carbs, then go for it (assuming you don't have a blood sugar problem).

Some weeks ago I tried paleo with very low carb - I tried to stay under 30 gms of carbs/day. I didn't feel fatigued as my body adjusted to the extra protein/fat, but I lost weight like a bandit. In fact, after a few days, I felt more energetic. I had to start adding carbs back in after I lost 8 pounds in a very short period of time.

I hear what you are saying. I was a vegetarian for 12 years before the MC hit. I really believe the large amounts of soy, whole grains, and cheese I ate helped to precipitate the MC. Can you eat seafood? You might like it better than "meat".

Hugs,

Polly

Sheila · Post by **Sheila** » Mon Jul 30, 2012 8:50 am

Hi Polly,
Thanks for the advice. I lost weight very, very quickly the first 10 days-2 weeks on the paleo diet and have been losing more slowly since then. I cannot afford to lose another pound. There are so many fruits and veggies that I can't eat, it makes it difficult to figure out what to do. I don't have a problem with blood sugar and have decided to add back in my homemade GF bread. It had to be adapted to eliminate the flours and starches that showed up red and yellow on the MRT test. I had a GF english muffin (tastes awful) along with protein for breakfast and I had more energy afterward. I love the morning glory/paleo muffins and may adapt those with a few more grains.

I am tempted to try eggs cooked into quiche or frittata just to see what happens. I tested positive for eggs on the Entero lab tests but don't have any problems using them in bread etc. They were a staple of my diet along with Boca Burgers, cheese and pasta. Fish is a good idea. Not a huge fan but I can certainly eat it once or twice a week.

BTW, I never had issues with indigestion etc before I started the Paleo diet. I think the gastritis was caused by Celebrex and I stopped that immediately after the first attack. I notice the indigestion after protein heavy meals and it is relieved by Tums.

More food for thought.

Sheila W

wonderwoman · Post by **wonderwoman** » Mon Jul 30, 2012 9:26 am

About a year ago I felt so tired and weak. I took my blood pressure at home and it was so low I couldn't believe the reading. Went to the drug store and took it again. Come to find out I was dehydrated. I made the recipe here for gatorade or whatever it is called and felt better right away. However, my legs swelled because of the salt in the drink.

Leah · Post by **Leah** » Mon Jul 30, 2012 9:33 am

HI Sheila. Everyone is different and I don't believe all of us do well with an extremely low carb diet simply because it is much harder for our bodies to convert fat into energy than it is to get it directly from carbs. It sounds like your system just isn't that good at this complicated conversion process ( ie: no weight loss). So, in tern, your muscles and organs aren't getting the glucose they need to operate optimally. If you are able to eat many fruits and veggies, the Paleo might work, but if not,it might be wise to eat a bit of grain ( or potato) with each meal. I still still eat rice and corn products..... again, a personal choice

Leah

Post by **tex** » Mon Jul 30, 2012 12:14 pm

I have something to add to Charlotte's comment about blood pressure/dehydration. As you are probably aware, I take BP meds to lower my BP as a stroke-prevention precaution (not because I normally have high BP).

I always check my BP before taking any BP drugs, because if my systolic pressure is below 100, I skip taking the drugs. On the days when my systolic pressure is below 100, I have about as much energy as a hibernating slug. LOL. I have a hunch that summer temps have a lot to do with it because my BP tends to be consistently lower in the summer, than at any other time of year. In fact, my BP seems to be rather closely tied to the ambient temp and how much water I drink, and it regularly varies drastically.

Of course, I have no colon to recycle water, so I'm more vulnerable to dehydration than I used to be, but I noticed the BP trend years before my colon was removed, so I'm convinced that it's an issue that's due to loss of blood volume associated with normal water loss caused by higher temps. I drink a lot of water all day (more than I should need, and before I become thirsty), but the problem still exists. Strangely, my doctor is totally unaware of a seasonal trend in BP, so I'm guessing that this is the prevailing opinion in the medical community. I've been recording my BP for years, and I'm convinced they're wrong (presumably because no researcher has ever published a controlled, double-blind study of seasonal BP trends).

I suspect that some of us are just naturally more prone to experiencing this effect than others, and obviously our daily routine has a major effect, also.

Tex

Sheila · Post by **Sheila** » Mon Jul 30, 2012 1:53 pm

I think I will invest in a BP machine. We have plenty of heat here in Florida and I don't drink all that much fluid. When I went to have my blood drawn for the MRT test the blood couldn't be drawn because I was dehydrated. They gave me a bottle of water and the blood liquified enough to draw the vials necessary. Dehydration is probably part of the problem and the other is my body's inability to deal with a strict low carb paleo diet.

I have an "egg" question. According to the Entero lab test I should not be eating eggs. I make a GF bread that contains 2 whole eggs and 2 egg whites without any evident problem. I understand that eggs change chemically when they are incorporated into something like bread. Do they change chemically if made into a quiche or frittata?? This is probably wishful thinking but I miss eggs in my diet. My MRT tests green for eggs and I do understand that is different from Entero Lab testing.

Thanks for all of the input. I'm going to modify the paleo diet until it works for me, take my BP and try to drink more water/fluids.

Sheila W

Post by **tex** » Mon Jul 30, 2012 4:26 pm

Sheila,

Here's my theory on eggs and their effect on people who have MC:

Note that this is just a theory, and no medical professional I am aware of (or anyone else, for that matter) endorses or otherwise accepts this theory.

Based on the accumulated experiences of members here, I have a hunch that, similar to yeast sensitivity, egg sensitivity may be due to a type of molecular mimicry. Otherwise, there is no logical explanation for the fact that some people can eat eggs in baked goods, and/or eat eggs after sufficient healing time. Normal baking temperatures do not destroy the gluten molecule, nor any of the antigenic peptides that are part of the gluten molecule.

There is little question in my mind that molecular mimicry (or a reasonable facsimile) explains why a positive yeast antibody test result is no longer a problem for most of us after we achieve remission and our gut heals, because this phenomenon seems to be very common among members here. After seeing this same change occur over and over with members who test positive to eggs, I'm becoming convinced that eggs may follow a similar trend, though egg sensitivity appears to be more persistent than yeast sensitivity. IOW, more healing seems to be required before they lose their ability to cause a reaction.

In fact, I have a hunch that some day it will be shown that all of the food sensitivities other than gluten, are secondary to gluten, and they probably would never have occurred in the absence of gluten-sensitivity (more specifically, untreated gluten-sensitivity). Besides myself, there are one or two other members here who have managed to develop a tolerance to casein, for example. It's almost impossible to get to the point where we do not continue to produce antibodies to casein, though, because apparently the offending peptide is so similar to one of the antigenic gluten peptides, and it's almost impossible to avoid all traces of gluten these days. Even tiny traces of gluten cross-contamination are sufficient to perpetuate the production of antibodies to casein and other secondary food sensitivities. Because of that, and other reasons, I'm not going to hold my breath, waiting for the guys in the white coats to prove or disprove this theory.

Tex

Sheila · Post by **Sheila** » Mon Jul 30, 2012 4:47 pm

Thanks, Tex. Your theory is logical and makes sense and I'm willing to try it out. Hello spinach and mushroom frittata!! Eggs have always been a comfort food and I've never had any kind of reaction after eating them. The Entero lab results were puzzling. A number of the foods on the MRT test to which I'm sensitive are foods that I never "liked" much and avoided when possible. Of course, others are things that I love and have eaten too much over the years, i.e. chocolate.

I'm anxiously waiting for your book to come out. My doctor will surely get a copy.

Sheila W