Anti depressant usage as mental breakdowns!

[barbiem]

thanks DJ - this is a much nicer group than SCD!! Can I ask what your diet entails and how long you have had MC?

[DJ]

Hi Babs, "The great flood of MC" began in late March of this year. I have had other GI symptoms for many years (without diarrhea) that are very likely related to this illness. I was diagnosed by biopsy then placed on Entocort on 5/31/13. Between the Entocort and a restrictive diet, I'm doing better. My BMs are not entirely normal but I don't have diarrhea often and when I do, it's not floods. Like you, I find trial and error with food tiring but I keep reminding myself that it's top priority. My dietary changes are huge. My husband and I have a large organic garden and one of my mainstays had been kale. I'm still picking it but not for myself. I've gone from a diet very high in fruits and veggies to a meat focus with small quantities of tolerated fruits and veggies. I'm satisfied with my progress so far because I have hope that things will progress and improve. My current goal is to slowly add to my diet.
I currently eat all meats (except processed meats containing wheat, soy, or dairy), fresh fish (or canned fish that does not contain soy), some brands of hot dogs, millet bread, limited amounts of homemade bread (limiting chickpea flour), heavily cooked green and yellow squash, broccoli, green beans, peppers, onions, and cauliflower in moderation, watermelon, blueberries, strawberries, applesauce, canned peaches, canned pears in moderation, sweet potatoes, white potatoes, rice, quinoa, corn pasta, rice pasta, hot rice cereal, gluten free Rice Krispies, grits, taco shells (read label), potato chips (read label), nacho chips (read label) ketchup, mustard, olive oil, sweet pickle relish, vinegar, very specific salad dressings (read label), Hellmann's canola mayonnaise (olive oil mayo is loaded with soybean oil), coffee, tea, water, Rice Dream Beverage, coconut beverage, and So Delicious dairy free coconut milk creamer. NOW COMES THE BIG CAUTION SIGN: I go heavy on the protein and I eat controlled amounts of plant life. I might eat meat and eggs only for breakfast, potato chips mid-morning, a sandwich for lunch, fruit or a juice box in the afternoon, and protein with a sweet potato and/or veggies for dinner. Portion control is key for me. If things get a little looser, I pull back on the plant life. So, although I'm not bothered by these fruits and veggies, I would be bothered by quantity.
I have some quick and easy "go to" foods. I make taco meat in quantity and freeze small bowls. That allows me to defrost meat, heat shells, and open salsa for a nice meal. I really load the salsa on and it doesn't bother me. I also make hot dog sandwiches with hot dogs sliced in half, millet bread, mustard and relish. Yum. I always try to have food easily available at home because I have problems with exhaustion and I could end up eating potato chips for dinner:yikes:
For Thanksgiving or Christmas I could have turkey or ham (as long as I read the label), sweet potatoes with brown sugar or coconut milk, well cooked green and yellow squash, or other well cooked veggies, cranberry sauce, sparkling apple juice, and jello. I could also make my grandmother's recipe for Canadian meat stuffing (mostly potatoes, ground pork, ground beef, caramelized onions, lots of celery salt, and lots of ground cloves.)
I read the SCD list and it wouldn't be for me. I'm not ready for kale, citrus, fruit skins (apple, peach, etc.), most uncooked fruits, citrus juices, uncooked veggies, absolutely no alcohol, no cheese, butter, or other dairy, no nuts, and no beans.
I hope this helps.
DJ

[barbiem]

wow I wish I was you!! I also diagnosed in feb yet still cannot eat anything except chicken, beef, bison all hormone/antibiotic free and now just green beans and carrots due to fodmaps issues. I also believe I have mast cell issues hence my reason for the lack of variety of foods. I had a recent flare which brought me back down to 114lbs just from adding in a gluten free grain. I can't do any grains at all and want sooo bad to be able to use white rice flour to make something but you think I can find a recipe that doesn't have eggs/sugar/guar gum etc. UGH. I also have lived with IBS for 20 years so was used to not eating certain foods but not all foods like I am now hence the depression. I keep telling my drs there is something more going on here than colitis especially since being on entocort isn't helping.

[maestraz]

Hi Babs,
I was glad to hear that you made an appointment with a mental health professional, and hope it helps. It sounds like what you're experiencing is way beyond just having the blues.

I am one who had to go off Celexa, and have been taking Wellbutrin for about 2 years now. I have done well on it. Given that constipation is a listed side effect for it, I think it may have helped, LOL.

Regarding your grief about food, I notice that you repeatedly say things like you are grieving never being able to eat anything delicious again. I went through that too, in the beginning of trying to get my diet in order. However, what I quickly realized was that, once I was past the crisis stage, and things had calmed down, there were in fact delicious things that I could safely eat, and I chose to focus on what I COULD eat rather than what I couldn't. Bumming out about lost foods was, pun intended, eating up too much of the energy I needed to heal.

Do I miss favorite foods? Sure, and they are: Philadelphia sticky cinnamon buns, our family's traditional turkey stuffing, my mom's macaroni and cheese, and delicious Italian and French breads. But coming to a point of acceptance means you have to view those things as NOT FOOD. As someone on here said, and which helped me greatly toward acceptance, food is nourishing; it doesn't make you sick.

I agree with Joe: maybe you're trying to think about too many things at once. When that happens, it's hard to step back and come up with a plan to regain your sense of control. The first thing is to deal with your depression, and find an assortment of a few foods you can safely eat. Eat them for a while, probably longer than you expect, and give your body a chance to settle down. You will find after a while that you can add things back.

With MC, there is no magic bullet. The keys are patience and persistence, as all here have learned. Hang in there.

[DJ]

Babs, I did a strict elimination diet a few years ago where I ate only four foods and worked my way up one food at a time. I learned a lot! Although I knew that my listed foods made my tummy grind and caused me to cough and gag terribly, I continued to eat them in small amounts......poor choice on my part. I was taking PPIs for my whopping GERD and aspirin for my neck and knees. I believe that the food and medications brought on the Great Flood of MC. Now I am GF, SF, DF, nut-free and at least for now, chicken free. I'm down to 3 mg of Entocort and my aches and pains are doing very well. I've been taking Claritin for a week or so and I think it may be calming my GERD a bit. I plan on staying on Claritin for about two more weeks then I will go off to see if there is a difference. With my reduction in Entocort almost four weeks ago, my gut is more sensitive. My intake of fruits and veggies is a bit lower since the reduction. I'm hoping the reduction in fruits and veggies will address my softer, more frequent bms over the next few weeks.
You are pressing forward one step at a time. It's the only way to go

[carolm]

Babs, it actually makes very good sense that depression can accompany our LC/MC. Here is a quote from an article from the American Psychological Association.

"Gut bacteria also produce hundreds of neurochemicals that the brain uses to regulate basic physiological processes as well as mental processes such as learning, memory and mood. For example, gut bacteria manufacture about 95 percent of the body's supply of serotonin, which influences both mood and GI activity."

http://www.apa.org/monitor/2012/09/gut-feeling.aspx

So, when our gut doesn't function well, it's not producing the serotonin we need. Then add to that our grief from losing our health (and the life limiting challenges we have now), and the loss of our favorite foods and the baffling task of figuring out what we can eat.... and depression is sure to result.

You are in the right place however... if it wasn't for this support group and the info I received here, I would not be in remission, which just happened for me 2 months ago, after 2 years of hard work, tests, careful eating, careful planning and several life style changes. It's a 2 step forward, one back process. I did best when I treated my food challenges like a research experiment, and I certainly had my share of fear and doubt. But I just kept coming back here and I believed that if others could achieve remission I could too, and I studied how they did it.

Lastly, I want to add that suicidal thoughts and total despair are NOT to be taken lightly and I believe are not typical. I was relieved to see that you will be seeing a therapist to help you through this. Please keep us posted on your progress and feel free to ask or share whatever you need.

Be kind to yourself,
Carol

[barbiem]

Thanks Carol - it is very disheartening to think it took you 2 years to reach remission!! why so long?? that is insane!! Tonight I tried white rice for the first time and was very sick - not really Diarrhea but lots of pain, smelly gas, burps etc. not a happy belly that's for sure! I guess if I knew what I was going through was normal (being unable to eat anything) then I might feel a bit better but I just can't believe that no one in the medical field knows how to treat this to get faster results.

What did you find helped you diet wise??

thxs

[maestraz]

Babs,
In my experience, the first thing to go should be gluten, which the vast majority of us are intolerant to. When I gave it up, I started to see positive results in a few weeks.

Obviously, with the reaction you describe, rice isn't working for you either. For a starch, try potato or sweet potato.

When we are in a flare, fiber is not our friend, so I would cut out the fresh fruit and veggies for a while.

I ate tons of protein in the beginning, which the body needs to heal, so you should try to find meat or fish that agrees with you.

Those are some initial steps you could take. But I caution you, that, as Carol and I have both said, there is not going to be a quick fix. There just isn't. Like Carol, it took me a couple of years to get things settled down and from out of control, to controllable, to normal.

When I was diagnosed, my GI doc gave me a copy of what a diagnostic manual had to say about MC, which was just a few paragraphs, and told me that the reason they know so little about it is that it is relatively rare, and not fatal, and therefore not a research priority. At least, my GI was the one who suggested cutting gluten, where many docs don't buy into the food connection. That's why WE, ourselves need to take control and do what's necessary to help ourselves heal. Nobody can do it for you, but you.

[carolm]

Babs,
I guess it's a matter of perspective but I was happy that it only took me 2 years to remission. Both Tex and the seasoned MCers on this board plus my GI doc told me it would take approximately 2 years. The GI tract is a large system to have inflamed and it is slow to heal. My GI doc (who also believes that food sensitivities play a huge role in MC) told me that 50% of my diet needed to be protein. All your doctors can do for you is prescribe you a med like Entocort that will reduce the inflammation and make you semi-functional again but these meds do not help you heal. It's eliminating the problem foods that will start the healing. That and adding in vitamins as soon as you can. It's like if you had a broken bone in your hand and you keep assaulting your hand by hitting things with your fist-- it won't heal. If we keep assaulting our leaky and inflamed GI tracts with the very foods that make them inflamed, they won't be able to heal. Once our autoimmune genes have been triggered there is no turning back-- only going forward.

My diet was also no acidic foods, no caffeine, low sugar, low fat, no fiber (so no uncooked vegetables or fruit), and of course nothing processed.

I ate chicken, rice, ground beef, potatoes, carrots and green beans everyday for a full year. I had such horrible nausea that some days I was simply poking down food because I knew I had to have the calories. I rotated foods around so that if I ate chicken and rice for lunch, it was beef and potatoes for dinner. The next day it might be beef and rice, so dinner was chicken and potatoes with whatever vegetable I didn't eat at noon. It was hard and yet it wasn't. I was so horribly sick with my first big flare that I would do whatever it took to get well. I rotated them in case I had any reaction I didn't over load myself. I started Entocort just a couple of weeks after my diagnosis. I was gradually getting better (even though still dealing with nausea, weakness, rapid weight loss). I had cut out gluten and dairy. After many weeks on Entocort I was still having gurgling so I cut out soy and that made a big difference. Turned out I'm highly sensitive to soy. It was when I was titrating off of Entocort that I found I was reacting to eggs, but Entocort had masked it. Enterolab results confirmed that I was reacting to the big 4 but also confirmed I was okay eating the foods I thought were okay-- chicken, rice, beef, potatoes, etc. I was able to add almond butter, almond milk, turkey and rice Chex.

The way I ran a food challenge was to stick to my baseline diet of safe foods then try the new food 1 time each day for 3 consecutive days. If I had no reactions (D or discomfort and gurgling) then I considered it safe and I went back to 1 day of my baseline diet again before challenging a new food. Generally it was an all or nothing proposition-- if I was going to react I usually did within the 1st day, and typically with D.

I consider myself one of the lucky ones. Even in my little town of 20,000 I had a diagnosis immediately after my colonoscopy by a surgeon who knew if everything looked good on the surface then biopsies were needed, and I was in to see the GI docs within 2 weeks, also knew their stuff. The GI doc I worked with was actually very impressed with my progress. I credit this site. I knew from day 1 if I wanted to be in remission I was going to have to do what other people here had done.

Hope that helps -- and I didn't just bore you with my history.

Carol

[Leah]

I didn't read all the posts, but have you tried the Pepto Bismul Protocol? It works great for some people and is readily available. Eight chewables a day for up to 8 weeks, weaning down if you start to see that you don't need as much. I hope someone chimes in who has had success with it ( Entocort worked for me, so I never tried it)
Leah

[barbiem]

yep, tried it but no success and my stool colour was crazy!! also tried immodium which worked to a point but ended up with more pain

[barbiem]

I am going to possibly try entocort MMX which is timed release - I can say since changing to taking entocort in the am instead of lunch my mornings are 10x better!! so weird that makes such a impact!

[barbiem]

what supplements do you think I should start adding in? I tried rice last night for the first time and was suffering with stomach pains, burning under ribcage and very smelly gas. It subsided at about 10:30 and today I feel great and was sure I was going to be stuck in a mini flare for a few days but so far so good. I just can't believe nor can anyone else that something like that can trigger problems. I didn't have Diarrhea but went about 3 x last night. Does this mean no rice for me or is it just my body adjusting to the new carb since I don't eat carbs at all. I had the same smelly gas when I first introduced the pancreatic enzymes.

[tex]

Does this mean no rice for me or is it just my body adjusting to the new carb since I don't eat carbs at all. I had the same smelly gas when I first introduced the pancreatic enzymes.

If you haven't eaten any carbs in many months or longer, then it may take some time for your digestive system and your gut bacteria population to adjust to the addition of a source of carbs in the diet.

Of course, it could also mean that you are sensitive to rice. Time will tell.

Tex

[barbiem]

LOL - so should I try it again today?? or leave it for a few days and try again? this is where I get confused as I have no idea what to do next