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Well, as I may have mentioned, my Mom moved in with me last Saturday.
Last night she had a rough night (I didn't hear her and she didn't wake me up, I'm sorry to say). She started out with constipation, cramps......... went on to watery D, very sore place in her left side that hurt when she even walked to the bathroom. Chills (she took a pill with Tylenol in it so by morning her temp was normal and has continued to be normal but she also took some ibuprofin this morning. She got almost no sleep last night and today she was rather "unbalanced" walking and was very weak. I'm sure dehydration. I took steps to correct that myself.
Anyway, at 9 AM I called the Dr.'s office. Described the symptoms, told them I thought she had diverticulosis (she was told a long time ago that she had some pockets but never had much in the way of symptoms). The nurse called me back in about an hour or so and said they would call in some antibiotics. Didn't even want to see her. I couldn't believe it. This doctor has only been her doctor for maybe 4 years and I don't believe he ever knew she had any pockets. Did he just blow her off because of her age (86) or did he trust me enough and the symptoms were classic enough so he didn't feel he needed to see her.
He prescribed Cipro (2 daily) and Flagyl (3 daily). No other instructions such as "soft diet" or anything else.
I realize that nobody here can answer that question but it's been kind of bothering me so I decided to "get it off my chest".
Perhaps not making her come in was for her comfort. I don't know. Just wondered what you all thought about it.
Love, Shirley
An odd happening??
Moderators: Rosie, Stanz, Jean, CAMary, moremuscle, JFR, Dee, xet, Peggy, Matthew, Gabes-Apg, grannyh, Gloria, Mars, starfire, Polly, Joefnh
An odd happening??
When the eagles are silent, the parrots begin to jabber"
-- Winston Churchill
-- Winston Churchill
I have had several diverticulitis attacks, though I haven't had any since I've had MC.
I'm surprised that the doctor didn't want to see her. They always push on my abdomen to see if I have pain and where it is. Also, they take my temperature.
The recommended diet for diverticulitis is pretty controversial. My PCP used to tell me to avoid seeds, nuts, etc., but my GI says diet has nothing to do with it. He said that most people in their 60's and older have diverticulosis, but it doesn't develop into diverticulitis, so it's a stretch to say that diet is causing the attacks. I no longer worry about eating nuts, seeds, etc.
The last time I had an attack, the doctor prescribed Flagyl and Levaquin. I used to take Levaquin alone and it always worked fine. The combination of both antibiotics caused me to have D for five weeks straight from August to October of 2006. I got MC in January of 2007, just 2 months later. I'll always wonder if that double dose of antibiotics helped give me MC. I personally don't think that a double dose is necessary. All you're doing is buying time until the infected sac releases its contents and the diverticulitis attack passes. That's my understanding, anyway.
I hope your mom does fine and gets over this attack without incident. The doctor's response doesn't sound very professional. My PCP would never take my word for it that I had a UTI and I always knew that's what I had. I had to go to the office and bring a specimen before he'd prescribe Cipro.
Gloria
I'm surprised that the doctor didn't want to see her. They always push on my abdomen to see if I have pain and where it is. Also, they take my temperature.
The recommended diet for diverticulitis is pretty controversial. My PCP used to tell me to avoid seeds, nuts, etc., but my GI says diet has nothing to do with it. He said that most people in their 60's and older have diverticulosis, but it doesn't develop into diverticulitis, so it's a stretch to say that diet is causing the attacks. I no longer worry about eating nuts, seeds, etc.
The last time I had an attack, the doctor prescribed Flagyl and Levaquin. I used to take Levaquin alone and it always worked fine. The combination of both antibiotics caused me to have D for five weeks straight from August to October of 2006. I got MC in January of 2007, just 2 months later. I'll always wonder if that double dose of antibiotics helped give me MC. I personally don't think that a double dose is necessary. All you're doing is buying time until the infected sac releases its contents and the diverticulitis attack passes. That's my understanding, anyway.
I hope your mom does fine and gets over this attack without incident. The doctor's response doesn't sound very professional. My PCP would never take my word for it that I had a UTI and I always knew that's what I had. I had to go to the office and bring a specimen before he'd prescribe Cipro.
Gloria
You never know what you can do until you have to do it.
Shirley,
As you know, I used to have diverticulosis, also, (I say "used to", because I'm not sure if all the "tics" were removed when most of my sigmoid colon was removed, a few years ago, or not). Anyway, as I was reading your description, my mind was telling me, "sounds like diverticulitis, to me". I would think that most doctors would be thinking the same thing. Here's why I would be comfortable with what they did:
While it may be true that most doctors would probably request an office visit, (if they had a time slot available), if no time were available, they wouldn't be likely to suggest coming in next week, or the week after, because an acute attack of diverticulitis can be extremely painful, (and possibly dangerous, if a perforation should develop), and the patient needs relief, ASAP. Cipro is the default treatment, for intestinal issues that may involve an infection, (such as diverticulitis, C. diff, or a staph infection), and the Flagyl would presumably cover anything that might not be completely controlled by Cipro. If that doesn't work, the last ditch antibiotic would probably be Vancomycin, to try to handle antibiotic-resistant species. Other than a treatment based an educated guess, such as that, the other option would be a culture test, to determine the specific bacterial strains involved. A culture test is preferred, of course, but that would require 3 or 4 days or more, to complete, (on a stool sample).
When I went through my initial clinic tests, to determine the cause of my uncontrollable diarrhea, the first test was a series of CT scans, (to rule out cancer), and when they couldn't find anything remarkable, the ER doc gave me a prescription for Cipro, just in case, (as he put it), I had an infection of some kind, (even though he couldn't locate one). I suspect that a floroquinolone prescription is the gastrointestinal equivalent of the old "take two aspirins, and call me in the morning", routine. IOW, it's a safe bet that it will probably take care of the problem, without putting the patient at risk. In my case, it worked so good that the next day my D was history, and I had smooth sailing for a couple of weeks, until the Cipro ran out. By the time that my next appointment with My GI doc came along, the D was back in full force again, so he wrote a script for another two-week treatment, thinking that the initial treatment didn't quite kill out all the bacteria causing the infection.
Anyway, that's why I would be satisfied with that treatment, (unless it doesn't seem to be working, of course). I agree with the lack of diet recommendations, also, (as Gloria mentioned), unless she has a known stenosis in her intestines.
IOW, I believe that he trusted your description and judgment, and the symptoms are classic. I will concede that her age may have had something to do with his seemingly casual decision to write a script for a couple of antibiotics. I think that doctors these days are becoming more conscious of the long term risks of using antibiotics casually, so many of them are becoming more reluctant to prescribe them to younger people, especially, without first isolating the bacterium involved. Both Cipro and Flagyl are broad-spectrum antibiotics.
Love,
Tex
As you know, I used to have diverticulosis, also, (I say "used to", because I'm not sure if all the "tics" were removed when most of my sigmoid colon was removed, a few years ago, or not). Anyway, as I was reading your description, my mind was telling me, "sounds like diverticulitis, to me". I would think that most doctors would be thinking the same thing. Here's why I would be comfortable with what they did:
While it may be true that most doctors would probably request an office visit, (if they had a time slot available), if no time were available, they wouldn't be likely to suggest coming in next week, or the week after, because an acute attack of diverticulitis can be extremely painful, (and possibly dangerous, if a perforation should develop), and the patient needs relief, ASAP. Cipro is the default treatment, for intestinal issues that may involve an infection, (such as diverticulitis, C. diff, or a staph infection), and the Flagyl would presumably cover anything that might not be completely controlled by Cipro. If that doesn't work, the last ditch antibiotic would probably be Vancomycin, to try to handle antibiotic-resistant species. Other than a treatment based an educated guess, such as that, the other option would be a culture test, to determine the specific bacterial strains involved. A culture test is preferred, of course, but that would require 3 or 4 days or more, to complete, (on a stool sample).
When I went through my initial clinic tests, to determine the cause of my uncontrollable diarrhea, the first test was a series of CT scans, (to rule out cancer), and when they couldn't find anything remarkable, the ER doc gave me a prescription for Cipro, just in case, (as he put it), I had an infection of some kind, (even though he couldn't locate one). I suspect that a floroquinolone prescription is the gastrointestinal equivalent of the old "take two aspirins, and call me in the morning", routine. IOW, it's a safe bet that it will probably take care of the problem, without putting the patient at risk. In my case, it worked so good that the next day my D was history, and I had smooth sailing for a couple of weeks, until the Cipro ran out. By the time that my next appointment with My GI doc came along, the D was back in full force again, so he wrote a script for another two-week treatment, thinking that the initial treatment didn't quite kill out all the bacteria causing the infection.
Anyway, that's why I would be satisfied with that treatment, (unless it doesn't seem to be working, of course). I agree with the lack of diet recommendations, also, (as Gloria mentioned), unless she has a known stenosis in her intestines.
IOW, I believe that he trusted your description and judgment, and the symptoms are classic. I will concede that her age may have had something to do with his seemingly casual decision to write a script for a couple of antibiotics. I think that doctors these days are becoming more conscious of the long term risks of using antibiotics casually, so many of them are becoming more reluctant to prescribe them to younger people, especially, without first isolating the bacterium involved. Both Cipro and Flagyl are broad-spectrum antibiotics.
Love,
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
Shirley,
My mom is 86 as well. I can see where a doctor might do what hers has done even though I'm not sure I agree with it. DH has diverticulosis with the -itis a few times a year. His dr has given him a RX for Cipro and Flagyl that he can refill as needed! I argue with him everytime that it is not good to keep taking the antibiotics. I live in fear that he will eventually get MC! He just keep sticking his head in the sand! A surgeon said he needed to have a section removed from his colon and then he wouldn't have to deal with it anymore but surgery is a huge step and he is very reluctant to do that. I guess I really can't argue with that. (I have to eat almost no fiber and DH lots of fiber - somehow we eat most meals together!)
I think the dr trusted you and the symptoms are pretty classic. I think this is more common than we think.
Pat
My mom is 86 as well. I can see where a doctor might do what hers has done even though I'm not sure I agree with it. DH has diverticulosis with the -itis a few times a year. His dr has given him a RX for Cipro and Flagyl that he can refill as needed! I argue with him everytime that it is not good to keep taking the antibiotics. I live in fear that he will eventually get MC! He just keep sticking his head in the sand! A surgeon said he needed to have a section removed from his colon and then he wouldn't have to deal with it anymore but surgery is a huge step and he is very reluctant to do that. I guess I really can't argue with that. (I have to eat almost no fiber and DH lots of fiber - somehow we eat most meals together!)
I think the dr trusted you and the symptoms are pretty classic. I think this is more common than we think.
Pat
Pat,
A year before you joined this board, I had the surgery you mentioned. I didn't have a choice, because I had a stenosis, and it caused a blockage, resulting in the need for emergency surgery. I have to agree with your DH, though - if I had a choice, I would have to think long and hard about that, because it is rather serious surgery, and the result is a "short" colon, with less than perfectly formed stools, much of the time.
In fact, to show you how stubborn men can be, even though the ER docs insisted that I would die without the surgery, I called Polly and asked her opinion, and if she hadn't told me that I might as well go ahead and do it then, I would probably still be thinking about it. Of course, the surgery is not nearly as risky, when done on an elective basis. In my case, I couldn't even clean out, because of the blockage.
There's no question that removing the section where the diverticuli are concentrated, (presumably the sigmoid colon), would put an end to the nuisance of regular diverticulitis episodes, though. I guess if I were in his shoes, I would base my decision on the typical severity of the episodes. In my case, other than the blockage problem caused by the stenosis, I never noticed any diverticulitis symptoms. IOW, I don't recall ever having pain in my lower left quadrant. Usually, it was everywhere else.
Maybe he doesn't have any genes that predispose to MC.
Tex
A year before you joined this board, I had the surgery you mentioned. I didn't have a choice, because I had a stenosis, and it caused a blockage, resulting in the need for emergency surgery. I have to agree with your DH, though - if I had a choice, I would have to think long and hard about that, because it is rather serious surgery, and the result is a "short" colon, with less than perfectly formed stools, much of the time.
In fact, to show you how stubborn men can be, even though the ER docs insisted that I would die without the surgery, I called Polly and asked her opinion, and if she hadn't told me that I might as well go ahead and do it then, I would probably still be thinking about it.
Of course, the surgery is not nearly as risky, when done on an elective basis. In my case, I couldn't even clean out, because of the blockage.There's no question that removing the section where the diverticuli are concentrated, (presumably the sigmoid colon), would put an end to the nuisance of regular diverticulitis episodes, though. I guess if I were in his shoes, I would base my decision on the typical severity of the episodes. In my case, other than the blockage problem caused by the stenosis, I never noticed any diverticulitis symptoms. IOW, I don't recall ever having pain in my lower left quadrant. Usually, it was everywhere else.
Maybe he doesn't have any genes that predispose to MC.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
Interestingly, my PCP recommended that I see a GI to discuss a resection because I had several incidences of diverticulitis. That was the original reason I went to see my GI. I didn't have MC when I first visited him, though I had just ended the 5 weeks of D due to the double dose of antibiotics from my PCP.
Most of the time when I had diverticulitis, I went to the acute care clinic because I got it after hours, or it became worse after hours. I never had extreme pain, and I originally thought I had a hernia instead. I finally had a scan which showed the "hot spot" where I was having the diverticulitis pain and had the scan faxed to the GI.
To my surprise, my GI said he couldn't say for sure that I had diverticulitis attacks. He said it wasn't because he didn't believe me, but rather because he'd never treated me for it and he didn't know if they did blood tests, etc. I was pretty surprised, given that he had the scan test results in front of him. I was relieved that he wasn't in a hurry to do a resection.
As I mentioned, I haven't had an attack since my MC diagnosis, so as far as my GI is concerned, I haven't had any. I'm beginning to think that maybe the pain is due to a hernia, though he says if I have one, it's very small. I had hernia surgery on my right side, so I know what a strangulated hernia feels like. My lower left side used to always be sore to the touch before MC, but now it comes and goes. I wonder if I had diverticulitis attacks or not?
I can tell you that my GI would probably never take my word for it that I was having an attack - at least not until he examined me. Hopefully, that day will never come.
Gloria
Most of the time when I had diverticulitis, I went to the acute care clinic because I got it after hours, or it became worse after hours. I never had extreme pain, and I originally thought I had a hernia instead. I finally had a scan which showed the "hot spot" where I was having the diverticulitis pain and had the scan faxed to the GI.
To my surprise, my GI said he couldn't say for sure that I had diverticulitis attacks. He said it wasn't because he didn't believe me, but rather because he'd never treated me for it and he didn't know if they did blood tests, etc. I was pretty surprised, given that he had the scan test results in front of him. I was relieved that he wasn't in a hurry to do a resection.
As I mentioned, I haven't had an attack since my MC diagnosis, so as far as my GI is concerned, I haven't had any. I'm beginning to think that maybe the pain is due to a hernia, though he says if I have one, it's very small. I had hernia surgery on my right side, so I know what a strangulated hernia feels like. My lower left side used to always be sore to the touch before MC, but now it comes and goes. I wonder if I had diverticulitis attacks or not?
I can tell you that my GI would probably never take my word for it that I was having an attack - at least not until he examined me. Hopefully, that day will never come.
Gloria
You never know what you can do until you have to do it.
Thank You, Everyone,
I do feel more comfortable now, I believe. It just started bothering me after a while that he didn't seem more interested but I guess I have to believe there was a good reason. I was rather surprised that he had her on two antibiotics but I suppose he figures better safe than sorry. She says she feels some better today (still has the sore area in her left side) but she seems more stable when she walks and doesn't look and talk like she is in outer space or something.
Thanks for being there for me when I needed some counciling.
Love, Shirley
I do feel more comfortable now, I believe. It just started bothering me after a while that he didn't seem more interested but I guess I have to believe there was a good reason. I was rather surprised that he had her on two antibiotics but I suppose he figures better safe than sorry. She says she feels some better today (still has the sore area in her left side) but she seems more stable when she walks and doesn't look and talk like she is in outer space or something.
Thanks for being there for me when I needed some counciling.
Love, Shirley
When the eagles are silent, the parrots begin to jabber"
-- Winston Churchill
-- Winston Churchill
Shirley,
My mom got a UTI in Jan or Feb and she does have dementia but she was really out of it, very confused. We didn't know she had an infection, just that she was so confused. Fortunately the assisted living facility recognized that she was way more confused than normal and said that is usually meant a UTI so they collected a specimen, I called the dr and took the specimen to the hospital and lol and behold it was a very bad UTI. Antibiotics took care of it and the extra confusion was gone. So I think a bad infection must affect an older person's brain somehow. BTW she didn't feel the UTI like I do. They said that is common also. Glad your mom is better!
Pat
My mom got a UTI in Jan or Feb and she does have dementia but she was really out of it, very confused. We didn't know she had an infection, just that she was so confused. Fortunately the assisted living facility recognized that she was way more confused than normal and said that is usually meant a UTI so they collected a specimen, I called the dr and took the specimen to the hospital and lol and behold it was a very bad UTI. Antibiotics took care of it and the extra confusion was gone. So I think a bad infection must affect an older person's brain somehow. BTW she didn't feel the UTI like I do. They said that is common also. Glad your mom is better!
Pat
Thanks Pat,
She is a little nauseous tonight but I doubt that is unusual with the antibiotics. I made her understand that if she is sick during the night she should let me know. At least I think she did. I agree that any disturbance makes her "foggier" than usual. She has also had a couple UTI's that were caught when she had lab work for a regular Dr. visit. She didn't feel it either.
Sometimes I get a little scared thinking I'm going to miss something I should have noticed but she is so against going into assisted living. Also, I don't want her to be in one here. That may change on my part once we get moved to Pa. but I doubt it will change on her part. As long as I am able I want to take care of her but sometimes it's like talking to a wall. Can't tell if I'm getting through or not. Other times she seems pretty sharp.
Love, Shirley
She is a little nauseous tonight but I doubt that is unusual with the antibiotics. I made her understand that if she is sick during the night she should let me know. At least I think she did. I agree that any disturbance makes her "foggier" than usual. She has also had a couple UTI's that were caught when she had lab work for a regular Dr. visit. She didn't feel it either.
Sometimes I get a little scared thinking I'm going to miss something I should have noticed but she is so against going into assisted living. Also, I don't want her to be in one here. That may change on my part once we get moved to Pa. but I doubt it will change on her part. As long as I am able I want to take care of her but sometimes it's like talking to a wall. Can't tell if I'm getting through or not.
Other times she seems pretty sharp. Love, Shirley
When the eagles are silent, the parrots begin to jabber"
-- Winston Churchill
-- Winston Churchill
Shirley,
I admire you for taking care of your mom. I still work so it wouldn't work for me. Fortunately my mom was willing to move in this particular assisted living. It is a small retirement/assisted living facility and very nice. We have other assisted living facilities that aren't as nice. And the same price! It is only about 5 minutes away from me and I know she is being taken care of by very nice and caring people and I see her several times a week. I take her to all her dr's appts, etc. Hope your mom continues to improve. Hang in there!
Pat
I admire you for taking care of your mom. I still work so it wouldn't work for me. Fortunately my mom was willing to move in this particular assisted living. It is a small retirement/assisted living facility and very nice. We have other assisted living facilities that aren't as nice. And the same price! It is only about 5 minutes away from me and I know she is being taken care of by very nice and caring people and I see her several times a week. I take her to all her dr's appts, etc. Hope your mom continues to improve. Hang in there!
Pat
You are very fortunate to find an assisted living place so very close to home and especially one that is a nice place. The closest decent one I have found in our area in Pa is at minimum 1/2 hour to 45 minutes away. Actually, my sister and I took Mom to see it but she was not at all impressed. HaHa She acted like a "puffed up bullfrog" the whole time and wouldn't look at anything closely (if she looked at all).
Oh well, we reassured her that it was just a trip to see what it was like but she probably thought we were ready to "make her go there" which was not our intention at all.
Thanks, Shirley
Oh well, we reassured her that it was just a trip to see what it was like but she probably thought we were ready to "make her go there" which was not our intention at all.
Thanks, Shirley
When the eagles are silent, the parrots begin to jabber"
-- Winston Churchill
-- Winston Churchill