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Wishing U an early HAPPY NEW YEAR----May it bring U a wonderful year of new adventures--and most importantly the beginning of many healthy years to follow--
Namaste~~~
Barbara
ANT-perfect day to begin your new year
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barbaranoela
- Emperor Penguin
- Posts: 5394
- Joined: Wed May 25, 2005 6:11 pm
- Location: New York
ANT-perfect day to begin your new year
the fruit of the spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness and self-control
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barbaranoela
- Emperor Penguin
- Posts: 5394
- Joined: Wed May 25, 2005 6:11 pm
- Location: New York
thank U---so much for the greeting in Mandarin
--
Now--tis learning how to Xactly pronounce it without getting myself into trouble--
Lou and I lived--in the big New York City--actually --*it was the lower east side*---close to Wall Street and taking a wee walk we could go and see the Statue of Liberty (I always called her the GRAND LADY) ---
We lived in this awesome complex(which at that time was considered LUXURY) named KNICKERBOCKER VILLAGE--
--and a few streets from us--was CHINA TOWN--- where all the Chinese resturants were located--and where we often treated ourselves to a great meal--
Naturally, after so many years--the area isnt the same---but things do change--dont they!!
Lou and I-have gone home(as I still call it) to visit where we grew up--and I still get Xcited when we do--
Let's trust that 2010 is going to be a terrific year for everyone~~~~
Thank U again---
Barbara
--
Now--tis learning how to Xactly pronounce it without getting myself into trouble--
Lou and I lived--in the big New York City--actually --*it was the lower east side*---close to Wall Street and taking a wee walk we could go and see the Statue of Liberty (I always called her the GRAND LADY) ---
We lived in this awesome complex(which at that time was considered LUXURY) named KNICKERBOCKER VILLAGE--
--and a few streets from us--was CHINA TOWN--- where all the Chinese resturants were located--and where we often treated ourselves to a great meal--
Naturally, after so many years--the area isnt the same---but things do change--dont they!!
Lou and I-have gone home(as I still call it) to visit where we grew up--and I still get Xcited when we do--
Let's trust that 2010 is going to be a terrific year for everyone~~~~
Thank U again---
Barbara
the fruit of the spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness and self-control
Officially it is tri-lingual. Mandarin, English and Cantonese are the three official languages. When politicians and big business want to show respect and be deferential to Beijing they speak Mandarin. When they want to be precise in legal contacts and/or encourage global investment, companies and people they communicate in English. When the local population (about 80%) want to be themselves they speak their native language, Cantonese.
I find all educated Chinese in Hong Kong speak English. Many Chinese know that if they want to have influence in the world that influence will be gained through use of English.
Gong Xi Fa Cai (Cantonese New Year Greeting), Ant
I find all educated Chinese in Hong Kong speak English. Many Chinese know that if they want to have influence in the world that influence will be gained through use of English.
Gong Xi Fa Cai (Cantonese New Year Greeting), Ant
very interesting Ant, another question, what is the difference between Mandarin and Cantonese. Are they both languages of the same languages group? Is Mandarin what we, the rest of the world, consider to be Chinese? Always wondered about this and this is my change to ask somebody actually living there.
Dear Harma
There are many spoken Chinese language/dialects all "grouped" around the Sino-Tibetan language family. When spoken many are unintelligible to other Chinese speakers (i.e much wider differences than say Spanish and Italian or even Dutch and English). In the West (due to emigration) most people would consider either Standard Mandarin and/or Cantonese as "Chinese". But here is why the question is difficult......
The main Chinese languages are:
Mandarin (c. 836 million native speakers) is a group of dialects spoken in northern and southwestern China. Standard Mandarin, called Putonghua, which since the middle of the last century, has been taught in almost all schools in the Peoples Republic of China and in Taiwan (but not in the then colonies of Hong Kong or Macau), belongs to this group. It is the official spoken language of the People's Republic of China, Taiwan and Singapore (Singapore's official languages also include Englsh, Malay and Tamil). As mentioned before, the local populations of Hong Kong and Macau are quickly learning Putonghua as a second or third language. (Macau's three official languages are Mandarin (Putonghua), Cantonese and Portuguese.)
Shanghaiese (Wu) (c. 77 million speakers) is spoken in the provinces of Jiangsu and Zhejiang, and the municipality of Shanghai. The group possibly comprises hundreds of distinct spoken forms which are not mutually intelligible amongst each other.
The Min languages (c. 60 million speakers). The largest Min language is Hokkien, which is spoken in Southern Fujian, Taiwan (along with official Mandarin), and by many Chinese in Southeast Asia. It includes the Taiwanese, and Amoy dialects amongst others. Min is the only branch of Chinese that cannot be directly derived from Middle Chinese.
Cantonese (Yue) (c. 71 million speakers) is spoken in Guangdong, Guangxi, Hong Kong, Macau, parts of Southeast Asia and by Overseas Chinese with an ancestry tracing back to the Guangdong region. Not all subgroups of Cantonese are mutually intelligible.
Xiang (Hunanese) (c. 36 million speakers) is spoken in Hunan. "New" Xian dialect is significantly influenced by Mandarin.
Hakka (c. 34 million speakers) is spoken by the Hakka people, a cultural group of the Han Chinese, in several provinces across southern China, in Taiwan, and in parts of Southeast Asia such as Malaysia and Singapore.
Gan (c. 31 million speakers) is spoken in Jiangxi.
So for Chinese from different regions to understand each other with the spoken word they must speak Putonghua. In contrast to all the different languages, the written language of Chinese characters was one. So people who could not understand each others' local speech could understand each others' writing. However, there is a further twist. In the last century the communist government introduced simplified Chinese writing, while Hong Kong, Macau, Taiwan and Singapore have kept traditional Chinese writing characters. Whether the two writing systems meet in the middle or simplified Chinese will prevail is debatable. Meanwhile, when I put out a press release it is in English, simplified Chinese and traditional Chinese and split according to location.
So, you see, it is quite a complex thing. Although, perhaps not unexpected when we remember there are 1,326 million Chinese in mainland China and over 33 million ethnic Chinese living abroad.
Hope I did not bore you with this long winded answer! Ant
There are many spoken Chinese language/dialects all "grouped" around the Sino-Tibetan language family. When spoken many are unintelligible to other Chinese speakers (i.e much wider differences than say Spanish and Italian or even Dutch and English). In the West (due to emigration) most people would consider either Standard Mandarin and/or Cantonese as "Chinese". But here is why the question is difficult......
The main Chinese languages are:
Mandarin (c. 836 million native speakers) is a group of dialects spoken in northern and southwestern China. Standard Mandarin, called Putonghua, which since the middle of the last century, has been taught in almost all schools in the Peoples Republic of China and in Taiwan (but not in the then colonies of Hong Kong or Macau), belongs to this group. It is the official spoken language of the People's Republic of China, Taiwan and Singapore (Singapore's official languages also include Englsh, Malay and Tamil). As mentioned before, the local populations of Hong Kong and Macau are quickly learning Putonghua as a second or third language. (Macau's three official languages are Mandarin (Putonghua), Cantonese and Portuguese.)
Shanghaiese (Wu) (c. 77 million speakers) is spoken in the provinces of Jiangsu and Zhejiang, and the municipality of Shanghai. The group possibly comprises hundreds of distinct spoken forms which are not mutually intelligible amongst each other.
The Min languages (c. 60 million speakers). The largest Min language is Hokkien, which is spoken in Southern Fujian, Taiwan (along with official Mandarin), and by many Chinese in Southeast Asia. It includes the Taiwanese, and Amoy dialects amongst others. Min is the only branch of Chinese that cannot be directly derived from Middle Chinese.
Cantonese (Yue) (c. 71 million speakers) is spoken in Guangdong, Guangxi, Hong Kong, Macau, parts of Southeast Asia and by Overseas Chinese with an ancestry tracing back to the Guangdong region. Not all subgroups of Cantonese are mutually intelligible.
Xiang (Hunanese) (c. 36 million speakers) is spoken in Hunan. "New" Xian dialect is significantly influenced by Mandarin.
Hakka (c. 34 million speakers) is spoken by the Hakka people, a cultural group of the Han Chinese, in several provinces across southern China, in Taiwan, and in parts of Southeast Asia such as Malaysia and Singapore.
Gan (c. 31 million speakers) is spoken in Jiangxi.
So for Chinese from different regions to understand each other with the spoken word they must speak Putonghua. In contrast to all the different languages, the written language of Chinese characters was one. So people who could not understand each others' local speech could understand each others' writing. However, there is a further twist. In the last century the communist government introduced simplified Chinese writing, while Hong Kong, Macau, Taiwan and Singapore have kept traditional Chinese writing characters. Whether the two writing systems meet in the middle or simplified Chinese will prevail is debatable. Meanwhile, when I put out a press release it is in English, simplified Chinese and traditional Chinese and split according to location.
So, you see, it is quite a complex thing. Although, perhaps not unexpected when we remember there are 1,326 million Chinese in mainland China and over 33 million ethnic Chinese living abroad.
Hope I did not bore you with this long winded answer! Ant
Ant,
Wow! I never cease to be amazed at what I'm able to learn on this board, on any given day. The breadth and depth of knowledge available here is absolutely awesome. You've answered questions that I've been carrying around for a long time, and some of them I didn't even know how to properly ask. Way back when I was in grad school, and trying to select an appropriate foreign language for my field of specialty, I knew that the Chinese were going to be important contributors to technology in that area in the future, but I didn't have the foggiest idea which language/dialect to choose, so I picked German, instead.
Many thanks for that in-depth explanation, and insight into the languages/dialects in that part of the world.
Tex
Wow! I never cease to be amazed at what I'm able to learn on this board, on any given day. The breadth and depth of knowledge available here is absolutely awesome. You've answered questions that I've been carrying around for a long time, and some of them I didn't even know how to properly ask. Way back when I was in grad school, and trying to select an appropriate foreign language for my field of specialty, I knew that the Chinese were going to be important contributors to technology in that area in the future, but I didn't have the foggiest idea which language/dialect to choose, so I picked German, instead.
Many thanks for that in-depth explanation, and insight into the languages/dialects in that part of the world.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.
Tex, did you learn "high" German or "low" German? The history of the various German dialects, while not nearly as complicated as Chinese, is still pretty interesting, although I won't go into it here. I have to laugh at this because my Mom's parents were German immigrants, and my Mom tried to teach us kids German when we were little. She had an old beginning primer that was actually in the old German print script, not the English letters (think the stylized beer stein words). Also, the written letters had a unique script, and I don't know if anyone uses it anymore. I could never learn to read or write it as a kid.
Indeed, we can learn anything here..... our own PPedia.
Rosie
The history of the various German dialects, while not nearly as complicated as Chinese, is still pretty interesting, although I won't go into it here. I have to laugh at this because my Mom's parents were German immigrants, and my Mom tried to teach us kids German when we were little. She had an old beginning primer that was actually in the old German print script, not the English letters (think the stylized beer stein words). Also, the written letters had a unique script, and I don't know if anyone uses it anymore. I could never learn to read or write it as a kid.Indeed, we can learn anything here..... our own PPedia.
Rosie
Our greatest weakness lies in giving up. The most certain way to succeed is always to try just one more time………Thomas Edison
Rosie,
I'm not sure exactly what the terms "high" and "low" infer in this case, but I would assume that I studied "high" German, since I was using it to translate technical articles in the field of mechanical engineering. I would assume that "low" German would be what my Father's family usually spoke at family gatherings, since it seemed to be dominated by slang terms, (German slang, of course).
Like you, I let all that slip away from me, and never took advantage of that prime opportunity to learn the language, as a kid. Of course, I picked up a lot of the common phrases, but I never learned to speak coherent German. I agree with you - that script has always struck me as a pretty big deterrent to learning the language.
Tex
I'm not sure exactly what the terms "high" and "low" infer in this case, but I would assume that I studied "high" German, since I was using it to translate technical articles in the field of mechanical engineering. I would assume that "low" German would be what my Father's family usually spoke at family gatherings, since it seemed to be dominated by slang terms, (German slang, of course).
Like you, I let all that slip away from me, and never took advantage of that prime opportunity to learn the language, as a kid. Of course, I picked up a lot of the common phrases, but I never learned to speak coherent German. I agree with you - that script has always struck me as a pretty big deterrent to learning the language.
Tex
It is suspected that some of the hardest material known to science can be found in the skulls of GI specialists who insist that diet has nothing to do with the treatment of microscopic colitis.